Zygomatic Sandwich Osteotomy / Zygomatic Arch Osteotomy (forward vs lateral)

[Optimistic]

I too have an open bite that causes trouble speaking in some respects. Do you know anything more about people's abilities to speak after their open bite is closed?

In my case I had a lisp when I was a kid, then grew out of that to speaking just like anyone else. It was only when my wisdom teeth erupted that I began experiencing difficulties with my S-sounds again. For what it's worth since my braces have begun to compact my wisdom teeth I've noticed my lisp has disappeared.

So if indeed your speech difficulties are caused by the open bite and not an inability to make the sounds themselves, then I'd say braces and surgery should correct that.

Hope that helps.

[x]

In my case I had a lisp when I was a kid, then grew out of that to speaking just like anyone else. It was only when my wisdom teeth erupted that I began experiencing difficulties with my S-sounds again. For what it's worth since my braces have begun to compact my wisdom teeth I've noticed my lisp has disappeared.

So if indeed your speech difficulties are caused by the open bite and not an inability to make the sounds themselves, then I'd say braces and surgery should correct that.

Hope that helps.

It does, thanks.

Can't remember for the life of me if my speech improved when my open bite was closed...

I'd also bet a recessed maxilla can carry it's own difficulties with speaking.

[Tiny]

Hey, good news about the upper lip! I didn't know you had problems with it actually O.o

I don't...because I got filler!  I've been having about 1/2 a vial of restylene into it for the past 18 months.  I'm hoping after surgery that I won't need to

MM told me about the titanium implants he does in my last consult with him. Were you able to establish when he thinks implants are necessary?
I'd be interested to see where he himself draws the line and would recommend a patient to get implants, or whether he only uses the implants when requested to. Any idea?

I think when a patient wants significant elongation of the ramus and lateral augmentation.  He brought them up himself when I was mentioning my short ramus.  So I think to get the look that you want, it might be the best option. 

[Optimistic]

I don't...because I got filler!  I've been having about 1/2 a vial of restylene into it for the past 18 months.  I'm hoping after surgery that I won't need to

I think when a patient wants significant elongation of the ramus and lateral augmentation.  He brought them up himself when I was mentioning my short ramus.  So I think to get the look that you want, it might be the best option.

Interesting. I might talk to him about HA paste and an IVRO to see what that can achieve, and if I'm still not happy then I'll opt for implants. I've been analysing my face a bit more recently and I've come to the conclusion that I actually have pretty decent rami, they're just hidden because of the angle they come in at - something an IVRO can apparently help.

I'm still erring about this malar osteotomy. As you can see from my Brad Pitt example strong cheekbones really aren't essential for good looks, and I feel I'm already decent looking. I find it hard to justify that kind of risk. Perhaps it too can go on the back burner for a potentional second op along with implants 

[Tiny]

Interesting. I might talk to him about HA paste and an IVRO to see what that can achieve, and if I'm still not happy then I'll opt for implants. I've been analysing my face a bit more recently and I've come to the conclusion that I actually have pretty decent rami, they're just hidden because of the angle they come in at - something an IVRO can apparently help.

I'm still erring about this malar osteotomy. As you can see from my Brad Pitt example strong cheekbones really aren't essential for good looks, and I feel I'm already decent looking. I find it hard to justify that kind of risk. Perhaps it too can go on the back burner for a potentional second op along with implants 

I've seen class 3s with totally flat cheekbones get an OK result from paste so I imagine for someone with OK cheekbones, paste will give quite a good result, actually.  I think a malar osteotomy might end up looking really unnatural

Also, the thing you need to bear in mind about these models with the sharp cheekbones, is that they're also really skinny, including the male models.  Over the past couple of years I've lost some fat off my face and my cheekbones look a lot more prominent.     I can see the same in my sister - she's got quite prominent cheekbones at her current size (US 2) but she used to be bigger (US 10) and they wen't very obvious then.  The 'plus' size models who are successful are the ones who naturally don't carry a lot of fat on their face

[PloskoPlus]

I've seen class 3s with totally flat cheekbones get an OK result from paste so I imagine for someone with OK cheekbones, paste will give quite a good result, actually. 

Could you please post the links to these case?

I think a malar osteotomy might end up looking really unnatural
Also, the thing you need to bear in mind about these models with the sharp cheekbones, is that they're also really skinny, including the male models.  Over the past couple of years I've lost some fat off my face and my cheekbones look a lot more prominent.     I can see the same in my sister - she's got quite prominent cheekbones at her current size (US 2) but she used to be bigger (US 10) and they wen't very obvious then.  The 'plus' size models who are successful are the ones who naturally don't carry a lot of fat on their face

Well, then famous pro bodybuilders would be a good case study (there are heaps of photos of them with extremely low and normal BF %).  Say, Dorian Yates.  A quick google image search showed little difference.  In-contest-form his simply face looks haggard, rather than defined.

[Tiny]

Well, then famous pro bodybuilders would be a good case study (there are heaps of photos of them with extremely low and normal BF %).  Say, Dorian Yates.  A quick google image search showed little difference.  In-contest-form his simply face looks haggard, rather than defined.

Have you never seen someone going from overweight to normal or thin and see their face shape change?  Honestly? Come on.  Obviously it's not going to make as much of a difference on those with poor/undefined bone structure but but the face carries fat, and if you lose the fat, you will see more definition. (but not become a supermodel  )

As far as I understand it, weakjawbrah has normal cheekbones (rather than flat like class3s often are).  But is not as thin as a model and that's where part of the cheek concavity comes from - good cheekbones AND low body fat.  I've got a friend who is a boxed and every time he drops weight for competition his cheekbones appear more prominent and he has more cheek concavity

Casting calls for plus size models almost always state 'slim face'

[PloskoPlus]

Have you never seen someone going from overweight to normal or thin and see their face shape change?  Honestly? Come on.  Obviously it's not going to make as much of a difference on those with poor/undefined bone structure but but the face carries fat, and if you lose the fat, you will see more definition. (but not become a supermodel  )

Hmm... I've heard the opinion that heavy women often have "good faces", "if only they'd lose weight".  Maybe because heavy often implies "big boned" which implies strong facial features...

[Tiny]

cant control where you gain fat. some people gain fat in the face, others dont.

Yes exactly.  Successful plus size models are the ones who don't tend to carry much fat on their faces.   But everyone carries fat on their face to some degree and it's not massively common to see really concave cheeks on someone who isn't on the slim side of average
.

I carry quite a bit.  It sucks balls when young but it's good for when you get older (or so they say).  I'm 26 but usually get pegged for 23 or younger because of my roundish face, full cheeks and small chin.  Which is actually kindof lame because I own a business and really want to be taken seriously which can be hard when you're the same height as the average 12 year old!

[PloskoPlus]

Yes exactly.  Successful plus size models are the ones who don't tend to carry much fat on their faces.   But everyone carries fat on their face to some degree and it's not massively common to see really concave cheeks on someone who isn't on the slim side of average
.

I carry quite a bit.  It sucks balls when young but it's good for when you get older (or so they say).  I'm 26 but usually get pegged for 23 or younger because of my roundish face, full cheeks and small chin.  Which is actually kindof lame because I own a business and really want to be taken seriously which can be hard when you're the same height as the average 12 year old!

I have a soft face and broad to boot.  The upside - no wrinkles @ 36.  I hope Le Fort 1 advancement will stretch the flub.  But if they set back the lower jaw... May end with a moonface.

[Tiny]

Do you think UV exposure makes any difference?  For the record, I've stayed out of the sun most of my life.

It makes a huge difference.   A lot of my friends have their first wrinkles.  I avoid the sun and have none at all...I'm 26 and usually get pegged at 21-24

If you want to improve the skin, get retin-A and use it every 3 days or so.  It's one of the only things that actually works on a cellular level.
Other than that, lasers e.g. fraxel

Most skin creams are useless unless they're prescription

[Optimistic]

Well, then famous pro bodybuilders would be a good case study (there are heaps of photos of them with extremely low and normal BF %).  Say, Dorian Yates.  A quick google image search showed little difference.  In-contest-form his simply face looks haggard, rather than defined.

That's because the gear they're running causes face bloat. If they were natural then their faces would at some stage lean out. You can't be that low in BF% and have a chubby face.

[PloskoPlus]

That's because the gear they're running causes face bloat. If they were natural then their faces would at some stage lean out. You can't be that low in BF% and have a chubby face.

When on stage they are on a massive amount of diuretics (the leading cause of death for pro bodybuilders).

[geijutsu]

I don't know what y'all smoking but brad pitt does have prominent cheekbones, the pictures posted here are him in his mid 30s, while those models are in their early 20s so it make a different, here are picture of brad in his 20s:

[geijutsu]

The high cheekbones gaunt look that some of you are after is a combo of both bones and soft tissue distribution, reason why some assumed Brad does not have prominent cheekbones is because his soft tissue distribution is different than your typical gaunt male model.