The limits of surgery

[Gregor Samsa]

I did a little filler, a touch of botox, rhinoplasty (post accident but that's a moot point) and chin lipo and honestly...well as Lazlo said in my thread, it took me from about a 5 to about a 7.

I don't think you're a good example since you've had some pretty attractive features all along. You weren't a 5 before and you're definitely above a 7 now. The girl from the Obwegeser thread is the best example I've ever seen:

[PloskoPlus]

The Obwegesser girl is the most remarkable case I've ever seen. The only case where the eyes went from potato to beautiful.

[Modigliani]

Why have I never seen that before, it's an extraordinary transformation 

What was done?

[Gregor Samsa]

Why have I never seen that before, it's an extraordinary transformation 

What was done?

I believe Satan was involved.   

PloskoPlus has all the details of the surgery I believe.

[PloskoPlus]

Why have I never seen that before, it's an extraordinary transformation 

What was done?

BSSO, lefort I and iii.  The paper is a bit sparse on details.

[Gregor Samsa]

I still don't understand why she has no external scarring if a Lefort III was performed.

[PloskoPlus]

I still don't understand why she has no external scarring if a Lefort III was performed.

Modified lefort iii can be done intraorally and through the eyes.

[PloskoPlus]

This is basically all I want out of surgery too. I grew up having normal facial growth, and then somewhere along the way, things went south.  I think its when I hit puberty,  I started slowly getting verticle growth and it really sped up around 20 years old. My gummy smile kind of came out of nowhere. It seemed my maxilla just suddenly grew down over the course of a few years

That's the only thing detracting from your appearance. You're a good looking guy otherwise.  No homo.

[Gregor Samsa]

Modified lefort iii can be done intraorally and through the eyes.

I see. Still, it's almost impossible to find surgeon that is willing to perform it. Have you ruled out getting one?

[Tiny]

BSSO, lefort I and iii.  The paper is a bit sparse on details.

I think there may have been something else, too, around the brow region.  Look at her brow and eyes in the before picture - deepset eyes, heavy brow ridge and low eyebrows- features that are distinctly masculine.  Part of the reason she looks so much better afterwards is that her forehead and brow region is much more feminine -- the brow ridge is gone and the forehead is smooth.  It may be that they filed down the brow ridge, or added filler or HA above and below to disguise it.  Her brows appear higher, too - maybe an illusion from the surgery but possibly some botox going on?

It's also interesting how much fuller her bottom lip is.  The smaller chin and fuller lower lip again make her look a lot more feminine.  Generally I think that female class 3s see more of an aesthetic improvement after surgery than males, and for class 2s its the opposite.  For the same reasons, class 3 skeletal patterns look a lot "worse" on women than men, and class 2s look a lot "worse" on men than women.

I wonder why though, they decided to do a le fort 3 on her.  Sure, her midface is recessed but I wouldn't say that it's loads worse than many other class 3s I've seen

[nrelax11]

That's the only thing detracting from your appearance. You're a good looking guy otherwise.  No homo.

Hahah thanks man.

[PloskoPlus]

I see. Still, it's almost impossible to find surgeon that is willing to perform it. Have you ruled out getting one?

I'll be contacting Obwegesser and Sinn about it. My surgeon does them too, but only on syndrome cases AFAIK. He wouldn't even want to discuss anything like that. Like I mentioned before, after my weight loss he even  changed his mind about doing a higher lefort to a normal one "to keep the face angular".

[PloskoPlus]

Hahah thanks man.

Teling it like it is.  When I first saw your pics, I thought what's this guy doing here? But then I saw your smile.

BTW, I'm somewhat concerned why your surgeon wants to advance your maxilla - it doesn't look recessed.  Your profile is straight. I can see why in my case - mine is obviously recessed and i have an ante face naturally. Also I don't know why the lower jaw is "optional" in your case.  I would have thought such a decision makes a huge difference to the bite at least.

But don't listen to me.  I'm not a doctor and I have OCD (formal not self diagnosis).

[nrelax11]

Teling it like it is.  When I first saw your pics, I thought what's this guy doing here? But then I saw your smile.

BTW, I'm somewhat concerned why your surgeon wants to advance your maxilla - it doesn't look recessed.  Your profile is straight. I can see why in my case - mine is obviously recessed and i have an ante face naturally. Also I don't know why the lower jaw is "optional" in your case.  I would have thought such a decision makes a huge difference to the bite at least.

But don't listen to me.  I'm not a doctor and I have OCD (formal not self diagnosis).

I totally forgot to change that the lower jaw advancement is not optional. After he was finally able to look at my molds he knew it had to be advanced with or without the upper advancement.  And for my upper advancement,  he said only around 4mm. It is a little recessed and especially after pulling my teeth back with braces,  I've lost a lot of support in my upper lip. Both him and my ortho agreed that it could be advanced a little. Ive even asked a plastic surgeon who did some filler work on me about my upper jaw and he agreed its a little recessed. I wouldnt trust only his opinion though lol. Plus, my surgeon mention that most orthos like to see a 90 degree agle between the nose and upper lip and mine is over that amount.. Thanks for being concerned though.  I'll talk to him more about it at my pre op appointment,  but I trust his decision. He wants to keep all my movements pretty subtle. Nothing crazy.

[PloskoPlus]

Nrelax11,

Good to know.