Poor aestethic results from double jaw surgery

[overbiter]

I agree that he needs a genio but only as part of another jaw surgery. A genio done on its own would look strange with his jaws being the way they are.

Snackan, have you wondered whether the surgeon made your jaws worse after surgery. If he can't tell you how far they were advanced, how do you he didn't make you more recessed?

Lazlo, I can't see Sweden or any other country paying 100K for an Arnett surgery. That really is a pipe dream. Especially with the economic situation the way it is now. Governments use social healthcare to reduce costs, not increase them by buying expensive private surgeries.

[Lazlo]

I agree that he needs a genio but only as part of another jaw surgery. A genio done on its own would look strange with his jaws being the way they are.

Snackan, have you wondered whether the surgeon made your jaws worse after surgery. If he can't tell you how far they were advanced, how do you he didn't make you more recessed?

Lazlo, I can't see Sweden or any other country paying 100K for an Arnett surgery. That really is a pipe dream. Especially with the economic situation the way it is now. Governments use social healthcare to reduce costs, not increase them by buying expensive private surgeries.

no dude, this is the absolute truth, there was a girl on one of the forums, i thinking more and more she was from norway, others will vouch for this her post might stills be up on jawsurgeryblogs and because there was no one good enough in norway or because of the nature of her surgery or something like that (it was jaw surgery) her govt. paid for her surgery with arnett/gunson (it was either the govt/ or her insurance in norway I can't remember which) --but do remember that she had to do certain things through her consulate to have it done.

[Snackan1986]

Thanks for everybody?s comments.

I will try to reply to all of them quickly in one post, but won?t refer to any quotes.

I understand from all of your comments I really should benefit a lot from a second surgery with a better surgeon, so I will be looking for surgeons for consult to see what to do. Also I will see if I could meet with my surgeon again and try to understand why he has not been able to give me better results both the bite and aestethic. I have emailed a couple of surgeons in US now and also been advised about a couple of surgeons in other countries which I might also consider contacting. Of course it would be much easier if I could have it done in Sweden however I don?t see how it would be possible to find which one is better than the other since all of the surgeons are working publicly and not private, so no information on the internet etc. Also I wonder if Swedish surgeons perhaps do these kind of surgeries to seldom, hence explains the result and my bite may have been a difficult case for them which they are not used to (?). So I don?t think I could trust a Swedish surgeon one more time.

I don?t think I had no rotation of the maxilla at all, as seen in my post with x-rays in the PDF file. However due to the impaction of the maxilla there were some autorotation of the mandible.


I don?t think Swedish government will pay for a surgery with Gunson/Arnett however it?s possible that a Norwegian girl did that. Norway is a very rich country    However if my surgery results are as bad as everybody says they should pay some, but I don?t think they will.

Overbiter: Yes I am sure the mandible was actually advanced, but there must have been a misunderstanding between me and the surgeon about the 10 mm. I will try to get my full journal from them, so perhaps it could also explain any questionmarks.
Everybody write about how the incompetent the surgeons must be. Could there be any reasonable explanation the surgeon did what he did? And also why CCW was not done - for exampel extra risk in any way?

Before surgery I was perhaps also to focused on just the functionality of the bite and did trust the surgeons about the face aestethics. Also in Sweden you can?t really choose surgeon so everybody know. You can only have the surgeons in the country council you live in, otherwise the country council have to pay for the surgery if it?s done in other country councils which they normally not accept. I did not have to pay for neither surgery or braces.


/Niklas

[Hesse]

Is this me you're all talking about ?
I'm norwegian. I'm not sure if I posted anything here, but I posted something in another forum. My case was not severe. I had a consultation with Gunson, but ended up doing it with dr. Relle for different reasons. And YES Norway paid for it, but the only reason for that was that I was studying in LA at the moment. If you're a student abroad norway will cover all your health costs while you're studying. So -you might want to do it like I did -now I have both an MFA and I had a surgery hi hi 

[Hesse]

PS. Dr. Relle talked about norwegian surgeons being so up-to-date on orthognatic surgery. I don't understand that at all. They wouldn't do surgery on me! They wont do surgery on you unless you look like a freak. They don't care at all about aesthetics, and at least not lip incompetence. They did a genio to hide my bite. Not until I got to California I started researching and finally found dr. Relle.
that being said -I'm a bit nervous now. I had my surgery 5 months ago, and I still have problems closing my mouth, so I'm freaking out a bit. 5 months is a lot, I thought everything should be great now. I'm worried that he didn't move my upper jaw enough.

[Hesse]

yes, still have to force my lips together. And it's better of course, but it's still not quite there.. It seems like the more severe your bite are, the better jaw surgery can help you. Pretty obvious, but then you would think they could help me with no problem, when the pre-op situation isn't that bad. I don't want to post any photos on the forum I think. Of course I talked to dr Relle about it -he keeps telling me to be patient. I will go to him in October and bring it up once more. But -what would a surgeon do in this case -if he sees that he surely should have moved my upper jaw slightly more -would he do a second surgery -and would I have to pay for that? I don't have money to do that, and I will never get it covered twice by Norway. I am satisfied, and think I could live with this, and it might even be better after a full year. But since I still wear my lingual braces, I would rather go through a second surgery asap, than have to start a new round of it in a year. I'm not afraid of this surgery anymore! Now, I know what it would be.
i can't find a good photo now either

[CK]

it's "normal" but if you have to strain then it is not. also, if you are showing a lot of lower teeth, and less upper, that is not normal. people with open mouths (sort of looks hypnotic) tend to have a more difficult time with lip posture even with surgery.

strengthening the muscles is more likely to improve lip posture. surgery may only be a temporary fix. swelling can keep the lips together.

[Hesse]

I have lingual braces so it wont really matter if they are there or not.
What is Medpore implants? Never heard about it.

When I look at some photos 3-months post-up I can see that it has improved a lot. Here's some photos. (I'm not sure how long I will leave them here)
it doesn't show that much here, shows much more when I talk. It's just weird -it's like my lips don't know where to be right now, cause it's unusual. Ha ha hypnotic yes, that's the word
how do I strengthen my muscles!? 

[Snackan1986]

Hi,

Thought I could update this thread with my ceph predictions, after consulting with dr. Arnett since it might be interesting for people to see.

Summary of the movements:
Upper jaw downgrafted in the back with 14,4 mm and lower jaw advanced 28 mm + genio...

Anybody who has done such big movements and such a large advancement of the lower jaw, please pm me!




[attachment deleted by admin]

[Tiny]

Summary of the movements:
Upper jaw downgrafted in the back with 14,4 mm and lower jaw advanced 28 mm + genio...

Wow!!  But for sure you will need quite large movements.  Other surgeons might not move things or rotate things as much as A&G but I think you'd wind up with big movements with any competent surgoen

Will you be getting a BSSO or an Inverted-L/IVRO?  There is a guy with a very steep jaw like yours, can't remember the surgeon, and he got an IVRO with bone grafts for the gap

[Snackan1986]

Wow!!  But for sure you will need quite large movements.  Other surgeons might not move things or rotate things as much as A&G but I think you'd wind up with big movements with any competent surgoen

Will you be getting a BSSO or an Inverted-L/IVRO?  There is a guy with a very steep jaw like yours, can't remember the surgeon, and he got an IVRO with bone grafts for the gap

I will get a bsso. I have not seen any such large advancement on internet so would be interesting to see.

[overbiter]

Hmm, this sounds like a big movement Snackan but it could be just what you need. Actually I'm quite jealous, I would love to have a big movement myself but I'm not sure I ever will. It could be a dream come true for you. Hopefully you go through with this because from my own selfish perspective I would love to see how things turn out. Maybe you will end up with a godlike jaw, who knows.

By the way, did you go to California for the consult?

[Snackan1986]

Hmm, this sounds like a big movement Snackan but it could be just what you need. Actually I'm quite jealous, I would love to have a big movement myself but I'm not sure I ever will. It could be a dream come true for you. Hopefully you go through with this because from my own selfish perspective I would love to see how things turn out. Maybe you will end up with a godlike jaw, who knows.

By the way, did you go to California for the consult?

Yeah, i also think i need a big advancement, but its a bit scary when its so big. Hopefully it could be life changing in a positive way. Before all this i actually thought i had some kind of bdd, but when your face is that off it might explain it.

Why arent you going through with it?

Yes i did go to california for 10 day vacation and this consult

[pekay]

Summary of the movements:
Upper jaw downgrafted in the back with 14,4 mm and lower jaw advanced 28 mm + genio...

wow, how much were you quoted for all that?

[overbiter]

Yeah, i also think i need a big advancement, but its a bit scary when its so big. Hopefully it could be life changing in a positive way. Before all this i actually thought i had some kind of bdd, but when your face is that off it might explain it.

Why arent you going through with it?

Yes i did go to california for 10 day vacation and this consult

I am going through with surgery. I've met with the orthodontic team once. I was supposed to meet the surgeon as well, but he was busy. I just meant that I want a big movement but maybe the surgeon will say 'oh, you only need 8mm' or something like that. In reality I think I need about 25mm or so to look normal. That's why I'm jealous of you, you have a surgeon who is willing to do that.