jawsurgeryforums.com
General Category => Functional Surgery Questions => Topic started by: UnderMunch on July 25, 2016, 09:49:35 AM
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Hi guys
I am looking for some decent photos of the results that can be obtained from chin wing and chin shield surgeries. If any of you have any that you are willing to share either in this thread or in a pm, I would appreciate it greatly. It does not matter to me if eyes, mouth or other parts of the face are blurred out, or if the surgery has been performed in conjunction with other surgeries.
If you don't have any photos yourself, but know of another thread or an active user who has some, then that would of course also be equally great.
I find a lot of literature and photos presented by doctors, but not a lot of photos from chin wing and chin shield procedures.
Thank you for reading!
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I can send you pics
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I can send you pics
Did you have cheekbone work done? If so what kind?
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http://imgur.com/a/n27vM
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http://imgur.com/a/n27vM
Thanks.
I already saw this compilation of photos before, but I can't really ask the patients anything.
But thanks anyway!
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Thanks.
I already saw this compilation of photos before, but I can't really ask the patients anything.
But thanks anyway!
i know lol. Ive been researching chin-wing pretty much for years now and ive only seen so few clear results (only chin-wing without double jaw). There are only so many before/after on public display, so thats why i finally booked my consultation with dr Z.
Anyway of course i would also greatly appreciate if anyone who has done this procedure would come forward and show his results to those who also consider it!
but except from stupidjaws not many here have done it, are still active or are willing to show it...
what ive found is this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV5k15-6sTE
where at ~1:00 the x-ray of a girl is shown who had a chin-wing. because in the video they move the 3d-scan around, it helped me understand a bit better what kind of horizontal/vertical projection is possible with the surgery
another one is this xray of a guy who had a chin-wing+double jaw. again you can see what is possible
http://i.imgur.com/B2E2RMB.jpg
apart from that you've probably seen it all already too
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Can't see anything on that zoomed in image
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yeah why are there so few before and after chin wings?
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yeah why are there so few before and after chin wings?
basically only triaca/brusco and zarrinbal do it. and zarrinbal is forbidden to show the results on his website by german law.
also i guess people are so happy with the results, they never bother to go back to forums and post anymore. if they wouldnt be happy, we would have alot more people complaining about it online. triaca and zarrinbal claim they've done a few hundred of these surgerys already...
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As of 12 months ago, triaca had done over 900.
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As of 12 months ago, triaca had done over 900.
900 chin wing/chin shield procedures? That's amazing considering that I can count the amount of b/a I've seen on two or maybe even just one hand. But I guess that's a result of having only 2-3 doctors actually doing the surgery worldwide.
I seem to have read somewhere here on the forums that Dr. Zarrinbal presents his potential patients with a bunch of b/a photos when they pay him a visit for initial consultation: can someone either confirm or deny the truth of this observation?
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900 chin wing/chin shield procedures? That's amazing considering that I can count the amount of b/a I've seen on two or maybe even just one hand. But I guess that's a result of having only 2-3 doctors actually doing the surgery worldwide.
Probably half a dozen surgeons in Germany and Switzerland do them. AFAIK, all trained by Triaca. Another 1 or 2 in the United States. It's just genioplasty on steroids. Triaca did not invent them, as much as rediscovered and popularised them again. He told me that an American surgeon did something similar in the 60s, but because it was done before cone beam CTs, they would wreck the mandibular nerve, so it was abandoned.
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That's true. He'll show you a bunch of photos from cases that relate to yours.
Have you had surgery with Zarrinbal, or just a consultation? Were you impressed with the photos he presented, or not so much?
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Dr Z's results are amazing, when you have a consultation with him, he'll show you a wide range from people who have had the same surgery. Speak to Stupid Jaws who's had surgery with him. I'm having surgery with him in September. The good thing about Dr Z is that because of his wide range of skills and innovative techniques, he can pretty much exaggerate the movements as much as you want and in different directions where by a lot of surgeons have a level they feel comfortable at and won't go any further because they're still using the same techniques from decades ago and can't do any different
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Dr Z's results are amazing, when you have a consultation with him, he'll show you a wide range from people who have had the same surgery. Speak to Stupid Jaws who's had surgery with him. I'm having surgery with him in September. The good thing about Dr Z is that because of his wide range of skills and innovative techniques, he can pretty much exaggerate the movements as much as you want and in different directions where by a lot of surgeons have a level they feel comfortable at and won't go any further because they're still using the same techniques from decades ago and can't do any different
Thanks, Vic. I'm very happy to hear that. I already had a good impression of him from what I read on this forum, so this is just further reassurance that he's a good choice. He's also been very friendly to me in his email replies, and even wrote back to me once to let med know that there was a change in available consultation dates.
And yes, I already talked to StupidJaws and saw his amazing results. He just didn't tell me that his results were from Dr. Z or exactly what he had done. But lets not discuss that here without his consent.
Quick question: Did you bring a photo morph to Dr. Z of what you want, or did you just work it out with him in the office? I guess it makes more sense to discuss these things when you have the 3D ct skull scan? I'm just asking since I know most doctors don't give each patient a lot of time during the initial consultation, and I would like to be prepared when I visit his office.
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Make that two people who need to know this, I'm going to see Zarrinbal too.
Cool. We are then on the same journey in some sense, that's nice.
Did you actually go through with booking your appointment, or are you still in the planning phase? Dr. Z never made it clear if I can make the appointment via email or have to call his office. Do you know by chance?
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Probably half a dozen surgeons in Germany and Switzerland do them. AFAIK, all trained by Triaca. Another 1 or 2 in the United States. It's just genioplasty. Triaca did not invent them, as much as rediscovered and popularised them again. He told me that an American surgeon did something similar in the 60s, but because it was done before cone beam CTs, they would wreck the mandibular nerve, so it was abandoned.
yeah why the hell did Sinn say he initially did them, when he dfinitely doesn't. In my consult I showed him pics of them and he was like no that'll wreck the mandibular nerve. Also, he seemed all about doing surgeries the patient wants whether their good or bad for them. So like unlike Gunson and Arnett or Wolford, he'll just do whatever the patient wants --xcept patients don't usually understand a 10th of what's happening to them.
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How open/ comfortable is Dr. Z with operating on overseas patients?
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Thanks, Vic. I'm very happy to hear that. I already had a good impression of him from what I read on this forum, so this is just further reassurance that he's a good choice. He's also been very friendly to me in his email replies, and even wrote back to me once to let med know that there was a change in available consultation dates.
And yes, I already talked to StupidJaws and saw his amazing results. He just didn't tell me that his results were from Dr. Z or exactly what he had done. But lets not discuss that here without his consent.
Quick question: Did you bring a photo morph to Dr. Z of what you want, or did you just work it out with him in the office? I guess it makes more sense to discuss these things when you have the 3D ct skull scan? I'm just asking since I know most doctors don't give each patient a lot of time during the initial consultation, and I would like to be prepared when I visit his office.
I didn't take a morph, but I took at 3D model of my skull with me and we planned the surgery there and then off the model
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How open/ comfortable is Dr. Z with operating on overseas patients?
He does them all the time. Whether you're overseas or not, is not going to change the way he operates on you. He speaks really good english
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I didn't take a morph, but I took at 3D model of my skull with me and we planned the surgery there and then off the model
you mean an actual real 3d model? or the 3d-CT scan?
also can you tell me how many consultations there are until the surgery? is it first consultation-planning consultation-surgery or another consultation inbetween (i cant imagine more than 3)?
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you mean an actual real 3d model? or the 3d-CT scan?
also can you tell me how many consultations there are until the surgery? is it first consultation-planning consultation-surgery or another consultation inbetween (i cant imagine more than 3)?
Dr. Z calls it a 3D X-ray and you have to get it done at another clinic that specializes in dental X-rays. They are called Mesantis http://www.mesantis-berlin.de
I guess the Mesantis office is fairly close to Zarrinbal's office, so one could probably schedule to visit Mesantis in the morning and the go to Dr. Z around lunch time. That's at least what he suggested to me.
The 3D X-ray costs 160€ according to Zarrinbal.
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you mean an actual real 3d model? or the 3d-CT scan?
also can you tell me how many consultations there are until the surgery? is it first consultation-planning consultation-surgery or another consultation inbetween (i cant imagine more than 3)?
An actual 3D model, exactly the same size as my skull and you can remove the mandible from it. I only had two phone consultations, then went over to have a consultation in person then had a new phone consultation after. I will have another consultation the day before the surgery as well
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An actual 3D model, exactly the same size as my skull and you can remove the mandible from it. I only had two phone consultations, then went over to have a consultation in person then had a new phone consultation after. I will have another consultation the day before the surgery as well
what the f**k? where did you get and actual 3d model from your skull lol ;D ;D
okay thanks...so its two consultations in person than surgery...good to know
btw mesantis is close to berlin main station and the scan costs 250€ not 160€.
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An actual 3D model, exactly the same size as my skull and you can remove the mandible from it. I only had two phone consultations, then went over to have a consultation in person then had a new phone consultation after. I will have another consultation the day before the surgery as well
Why would you need an actual 3D model of your skull, or is that just what they gave you? Did the people at Mesantis create this skull for you, or another office?
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Why would you need an actual 3D model of your skull, or is that just what they gave you? Did the people at Mesantis create this skull for you, or another office?
I got it done in London then brought it with me. It allowed us to see my exact bone structure and what I wanted to change. It's really useful because you can see the exact size and position of your cheekbones, so Dr Z spoke to me about the cheekbone surgery he also performs.
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I got it done in London then brought it with me. It allowed us to see my exact bone structure and what I wanted to change. It's really useful because you can see the exact size and position of your cheekbones, so Dr Z spoke to me about the cheekbone surgery he also performs.
Okay, makes sense, I guess.
Is Dr. Z's cheekbone surgery any good, like, have you seen good results on other patients?
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Okay, makes sense, I guess.
Is Dr. Z's cheekbone surgery any good, like, have you seen good results on other patients?
Yea, some decent results in the before and after pics he showed me
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Yea, some decent results in the before and after pics he showed me
Were they mostly female?
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Were they mostly female?
Yes
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Hey now this is ridiculously precise question...but does anyone know how big the distance between the border of the mandible and the "foramen mentale" (i guess thats how they figure where the mental nerve is) must be so you can even do the chin-wing?
(https://www2.aofoundation.org/AOFileServerSurgery/MyPortalFiles?FilePath=/Surgery/en/_img/surgery/04-Approaches/91/A20/A20_i100_L.gif)
my "green zone" is about 1cm. is that enough to cut a piece of jaw away, not damage the nerve and then fixate the wing back onto the mandible? doesnt sound like a whole lot of room to make that happen :-\
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I got it done in London then brought it with me. It allowed us to see my exact bone structure and what I wanted to change. It's really useful because you can see the exact size and position of your cheekbones, so Dr Z spoke to me about the cheekbone surgery he also performs.
Where in London and how much did it cost if you don't mind me asking? Would love to do this.
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Where in London and how much did it cost if you don't mind me asking? Would love to do this.
Got it done at Cavendish imaging on Harley Street. Cost £450 I think. You'll need to get a referral letter from a doctor or surgeon like that
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Is Dr. Z's cheekbone surgery any good, like, have you seen good results on other patients?
It's good if you need lateral widening of your face at the cheekbone level. If won't magically give you model-tier high cheekbones. Nor will it give much, if any, anterior projection.
Also, if can worsen under-eye hollowing. It did for me, had to get additional surgery for that (from which I'm currently recovering).
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It's good if you need lateral widening of your face at the cheekbone level. If won't magically give you model-tier high cheekbones. Nor will it give much, if any, anterior projection.
Also, if can worsen under-eye hollowing. It did for me, had to get additional surgery for that (from which I'm currently recovering).
What did you have? Did you have rhino with dr z as well?
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It's good if you need lateral widening of your face at the cheekbone level. If won't magically give you model-tier high cheekbones. Nor will it give much, if any, anterior projection.
Also, if can worsen under-eye hollowing. It did for me, had to get additional surgery for that (from which I'm currently recovering).
what surgery did you get and how is the recovery going?
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What did you have? Did you have rhino with dr z as well?
I had bone grafted on top of my cheekbones by dr. Van der Dussen, alongside a malar fat pad resuspension. This to address the under-eye hollowing and general flat midface. In the same surgery he also performed a genioplasty since dr. Z's chin wing ultimately made my chin too long and asymmetric. Looks good so far, but I'm only 2,5 weeks post-op, so there's still swelling.
I had the rhino done by dr. De Jong here in the Netherlands. It's an improvement, but it needs some further fine-tuning. I will see him later this month.
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SO when I showed Sinn the cut made by Zarinabbal et al. for the chin wing he said he would never do that as it's very high risk for severing the lower jaw nerve and creating all sorts of problems, esp. full numbness. I'm very attracted to the procedure though. A few people on the board have had the procedure, but not a ton. I wanna have a better sense about the complications involved with this procedure.
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AFAIK the risk of mandibular nerve damage is not that high since Zarrinbal requires a CBCT scan to be made beforehand, so he can easily identify the nerve's position. Still, could happen that the nerve is disturbed somehow. There's no guarantee of success. I had zero nerve damage myself, even when the chin wing was combined with a BSSO.
A higher risk is that of significant introduced asymmetry, which happened to me and some other chin wing patients. A crooked chin does not look good, trust me. I had to get a revision genioplasty for that. Also, Zarrinbal really likes to exaggerate movements to create dramatic effects it seems. He's not always very subtle. Not everyone looks good with a heavy jawline or a massive chin. A couple of post-ops he flipped through during consultation looked pretty horrifying (jawlines/chins like The Joker), for instance. Ofcourse, maybe that is exactly what those patients wanted, and he simply obliged them. In that case he cannot be blamed I guess.
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AFAIK the risk of mandibular nerve damage is not that high since Zarrinbal requires a CBCT scan to be made beforehand, so he can easily identify the nerve's position. Still, could happen that the nerve is disturbed somehow. There's no guarantee of success. I had zero nerve damage myself, even when the chin wing was combined with a BSSO.
A higher risk is that of significant introduced asymmetry, which happened to me and some other chin wing patients. A crooked chin does not look good, trust me. I had to get a revision genioplasty for that. Also, Zarrinbal really likes to exaggerate movements to create dramatic effects it seems. He's not always very subtle. Not everyone looks good with a heavy jawline or a massive chin. A couple of post-ops he flipped through during consultation looked pretty horrifying (jawlines/chins like The Joker), for instance. Ofcourse, maybe that is exactly what those patients wanted, and he simply obliged them. In that case he cannot be blamed I guess.
Dr. Z sounds like the man of my dreams! Jk, but I rarely see any dramatic, or in my opinion worthwhile results from chin implants and genio plastys, so I am happy to hear that there are doctors willing to give you your money's worth.
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Subtle is usually better. Lots of people here seem to have long faces with poorly defined midfaces, and then a heavy jawline/chin can look very out of place, or make the face appear even longer (you do NOT want that). Midface is key. The best jaw surgery results I've seen so far have usually been people with well developed midfaces with plenty of forward growth, but weak chins (for whatever reason). Someone occasionally lucks out with a Le-Fort, but they seem to go wrong much more often than right.
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ZO is a relatively safe intervention. You just need to have realistic expectations. It will add lateral width to your face at the cheekbone level, so if you have a narrow face (like I had) it will help. It will not make your cheekbones higher, not will it add anterior projection. You will not suddenly look like a model if you had low cheekbones priorly. They could be moved upwards a bit, but this is at a much greater risk of asymmetry, according to dr. Z. The ZO procedure also might worsen under-eye hollowing towards the cheekbones (makes sense). The latter can be resolved/mitigated with bone grafts or perhaps HA paste, but would require additional surgery (and downtime). Finally, expect a fair bit of swelling and major discolorations under your eyes. Might take a month or more to resolve.
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I'm really starting to worry about going a head with chin-wing/ZO now. The asymmetry stories and complications are freaking me out. I keep thinking that i should maybe just save for longer and plan to go with triaca/brusco, or forget about it altogether and just stick with a second Genio from the quality UK surgeon i seen. It would give me the chin i desire, but my lack of jawline and cheekbones will remain.
what kind of asymmetry are you guys talking about?
i mean with this procedure some kind of asymmetry is a given due to the way the surgery is done...a unflexible bone wing with many asymmetrys itself must be moved intraorally in one piece from one position to another etc...i mean im not a surgeon but i imagine its more or less pure luck if you hit perfect symmetry when screwing in the bony wing back on the jaw...especially after soft tissue settles back into place.
i think asymmetry has alot more to do with the procedure itself than the surgeon. ive seen some youtube videos of jaw surgerys and im suprised how they get anything done really...theres only such a small opening where you can see what you are actually doing...blood everywhere too and everything must be done at an angle etc. i imagine chin wing is not easier to do.
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Yeah, some asymmetry is definitely to be expected when doing a chin wing. In my case it turned out rather significant though, necessitating an additional genioplasty.
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ZO is a relatively safe intervention. You just need to have realistic expectations. It will add lateral width to your face at the cheekbone level, so if you have a narrow face (like I had) it will help. It will not make your cheekbones higher, not will it add anterior projection. You will not suddenly look like a model if you had low cheekbones priorly. They could be moved upwards a bit, but this is at a much greater risk of asymmetry, according to dr. Z. The ZO procedure also might worsen under-eye hollowing towards the cheekbones (makes sense). The latter can be resolved/mitigated with bone grafts or perhaps HA paste, but would require additional surgery (and downtime). Finally, expect a fair bit of swelling and major discolorations under your eyes. Might take a month or more to resolve.
I'm glad you shared your experience. Very helpful.
You mentioned the ZO provides only lateral enhancement. Im wondering on what height excatly?
Since you're experiencing increased (lateral) under-eye hollowing I guess the inferior orbital rim stays untouched during surgery and the cut is made somewhere in the "middle" of the zygomatic bone (if that makes any sense). Would you confirm this?
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Just from the reports i've read on here and other forums, it seems to be the result of what you describe: a fairly tricky surgery and an unflexible bone wing being moved around. There does seem to be quite a lot of people mentioning asymmetry and it's quite worrying. I just wonder now if it really has any benefit over a regular genioplasty? If the improvements to jaw angles are as minimal as they sound, then i doubt there is any need for me to bother with it; i'd be better off just accepting it, or using filler/implants. Granted, i don't think i'll require a big movement, so that may lessen the risk somewhat, but it has got me doubting things!
Can anyone clarify exactly what the differences are aesthetically between a chin-wing and a genio? Does the chin-wing actually mimic the result of lower jaw surgery? (which is ideally what i need, but my bite isn't bad enough to warrant it)
http://i.imgur.com/jaoTJ5C.jpg
on this pic you can see how a chin wing can make the jaw a little more wider/more prominent...but not a huge improvement tho. if you want huge improvements you must get custom made wraparound jaw implants...but honestly most of the time they look weird as well...it sometimes looks like the people got bigger and wider jaws but soft and squishy like the jaw was filled with water or something lol.
anyway a chin wing will be closer to a jaw surgery than a genio because you will move so much more bone forward and the skin will be much more stretched....it gives a much more sharp and masculizing effect than genio because there is a bigger forward movement. also with genio there is the problem of a witch chin. it looks good from profile...but im not so sure a genio looks good from the front if you have a small chin. atleast thats my observation, but i guess for certain faces a genio is the better option, for others a chin wing.
overall genio comes with less change but also less risk for damage or asymmetry. chin wing is alot more difficult procedure which makes it more prone to problems...but in return you can hope for more extreme jawline results
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I think that even the mediocre results I've seen chin wings and genio plastys have been better than any jaw angle or chin implant results I've seen: implants seem to either make no difference whatsoever or just swell up the specific area where the implant has been placed, giving a big improvement but the rounded off look, not square or defined.
Wether that's actual swelling or a big implants, or because the position of the implants shift, I don't know. But I'm 100% sure I'm not getting any of the implants in my face that are currently available.
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It boils down to this:
Chin wing makes your lower jaw wider by basically disconnecting the lower edge and moving it forward/outwards. ZO makes your midface wider by moving part of the zygomatic bone outwards. Both movements are stabilised with bone grafts, often harvested from the hip (yay, big scar). Chin wings often introduce additional asymmetry.
So if you have a narrow face, both might be a good idea. If you're looking for flared jaw angles, improved gonion angle in the back, or high model-like cheekbones, then you're probably out of luck.
Avoid implants at all costs.
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You mentioned the ZO provides only lateral enhancement. Im wondering on what height excatly?
Since you're experiencing increased (lateral) under-eye hollowing I guess the inferior orbital rim stays untouched during surgery and the cut is made somewhere in the "middle" of the zygomatic bone (if that makes any sense). Would you confirm this?
Lateral width is added at the level of your current cheekbones by moving the inferior lateral portion of the zygomatic bone outward. In some people this can look bad. Yes, the cut is made through the zygomatic bone. Orbital rims are not touched, and you absolutely do not want to touch these as they more-or-less keep your eyes in place.
This is also the reason why ZOs can worsen under-eye hollowing: part of the zygomatic bone is moved outwards but the (recessed) orbital rims stay in place.
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I also have asymmetry from my chin wing. I honestly can't be f**ked to get it fixed though, it's minor.
Did you experience any problems with the incision in your mouth? I'm two months post op and it feels sooo tight. Seeing a max fac on Tuesday, I'm hoping he can see what's going on, as it's primarily on the left side.
In my case the asymmetry was quite significant. My chin looked crooked, necessitating an additional genioplasty. Dr. Z. thought it looked fine, I disagreed. No problem with the incisions, sorry to hear you're having trouble. Did you go to dr. Z. as well?
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Thank you for the clarification.
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It boils down to this:
Chin wing makes your lower jaw wider by basically disconnecting the lower edge and moving it forward/outwards. ZO makes your midface wider by moving part of the zygomatic bone outwards. Both movements are stabilised with bone grafts, often harvested from the hip (yay, big scar). Chin wings often introduce additional asymmetry.
So if you have a narrow face, both might be a good idea. If you're looking for flared jaw angles, improved gonion angle in the back, or high model-like cheekbones, then you're probably out of luck.
Avoid implants at all costs.
Re: bone graft, I wonder if calvarial (skull bone) grafts are ever used with this type of procedure. Apparently they are the most stable and less likely to resorb and I imagine the scar would be hidden under hair.
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lets also not forget this: once you got your aesthetic problems fixed its hard to complain about other things. going from recessed chin to prominent chin must feel great...for a few weeks...suddenly you are used to it tho and then you see the asymmetry, the crooked chin etc...of course you are annoyed by that and rightfully so...but we shouldnt forget that we are not doing this s**t for fun. we are doing it coz we are heavily aesthetically handicapped. and every improvement in that regard is great eventho it might not be 100% perfect
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lets also not forget this: once you got your aesthetic problems fixed its hard to complain about other things. going from recessed chin to prominent chin must feel great...for a few weeks...suddenly you are used to it tho and then you see the asymmetry, the crooked chin etc...of course you are annoyed by that and rightfully so...but we shouldnt forget that we are not doing this s**t for fun. we are doing it coz we are heavily aesthetically handicapped. and every improvement in that regard is great eventho it might not be 100% perfect
yeah but it's not much of an aesthetic improvement if it's asymmetric --sorry but that's just the truth. A guy with a small chin and a guy with a big honker of a chin that's f**king off to the side or not straight and balanced with the face are equally f**ked as far as I'm concerned.
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yeah but it's not much of an aesthetic improvement if it's asymmetric --sorry but that's just the truth. A guy with a small chin and a guy with a big honker of a chin that's f**king off to the side or not straight and balanced with the face are equally f**ked as far as I'm concerned.
i disagree. a recessed chin is the worst feature for a man in my book. i rather have a square jaw with a prominent chin with a little asymmetry than a symmetric small recessed chin.
my mandible for example is already asymmetric. on the one side my gonion lines up with my zygo...on the other side my gonion is more inward. also my mandible does some weird curves and s**t. so yeah...this could be alot better if i developed right. but guess what really kills me? and why i wanna do plastic surgery? my recessed chin. thats what really kills the symmetry of the whole face, not just the mandible
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Yeah, but when you end up with an asymmetric strong chin you will want to get it fixed ASAP, trust me :-)
We all are striving for 'perfection', otherwise we would not be considering elective surgery.
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yes we certain we will. but lets not forget what brought us this big prominent chin in the first place.
sure chin-wing is more prone to asymmetry and other problems than genio. but some people need the chin-wing. if they didnt need it they would go with a genio. now those people who need or want a chin-wing, they can still decide if they rather fix the problems theyve got and accept certain problems which might occur or if they rather dont change anything at all.
im always pro-change personally. i will very soon have my consult with dr Z...and if the cw is possible, i will book my surgery. i would hate to have any kind of asymmetry or pain problems or whatever...but i guess i hate it more to run around with a retruded chin and therefore too protruded nose.
of course we can still debate if the chin-wing is really the best option compared to double jaw/custom wraparound implant/genio.
but for some people double jaw is simply not in reach and genio creates its own problems too. an implant has its own problems also. so whats the lesser of all evils? whats has the best result/risk/cost-ratio? i dont know...
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Yeah, but when you end up with an asymmetric strong chin you will want to get it fixed ASAP, trust me :-)
We all are striving for 'perfection', otherwise we would not be considering elective surgery.
plus 1
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i disagree. a recessed chin is the worst feature for a man in my book. i rather have a square jaw with a prominent chin with a little asymmetry than a symmetric small recessed chin.
my mandible for example is already asymmetric. on the one side my gonion lines up with my zygo...on the other side my gonion is more inward. also my mandible does some weird curves and s**t. so yeah...this could be alot better if i developed right. but guess what really kills me? and why i wanna do plastic surgery? my recessed chin. thats what really kills the symmetry of the whole face, not just the mandible
DUDE EVERYONE HAS A SLIGHT ASYMMETRY even BRAD PITT, but I'm talking about noticeable asymmetry, and trust me the bigger your chin is or the volume of your jaw is which it will be to look BIGGER THE MORE THE ASYMMETRY will be noticed.
SO SORRY. NO TO ASYMMETRY. NO TO f**kING NOTICEABLE ASYMMETRY ON YOUR FEATURES. f**k THAT s**t AND FIND A f**kING CURE TO IT>
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Well, what I'm saying is that if you want a chin wing, be prepared to shell out the cash for a corrective genioplasty down the road as well. Keep that in mind.
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yes we certain we will. but lets not forget what brought us this big prominent chin in the first place.
sure chin-wing is more prone to asymmetry and other problems than genio. but some people need the chin-wing. if they didnt need it they would go with a genio. now those people who need or want a chin-wing, they can still decide if they rather fix the problems theyve got and accept certain problems which might occur or if they rather dont change anything at all.
im always pro-change personally. i will very soon have my consult with dr Z...and if the cw is possible, i will book my surgery. i would hate to have any kind of asymmetry or pain problems or whatever...but i guess i hate it more to run around with a retruded chin and therefore too protruded nose.
of course we can still debate if the chin-wing is really the best option compared to double jaw/custom wraparound implant/genio.
but for some people double jaw is simply not in reach and genio creates its own problems too. an implant has its own problems also. so whats the lesser of all evils? whats has the best result/risk/cost-ratio? i dont know...
There's not debate between chin wing and custom implants. Chin Wing is 10 times better. Implants will just give you a rounded face and f**k with your soft tissue
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What are the chances of the nerve being in the way? Is it relatively rare or common? I suppose there's no way around it if the nerve hangs low..?
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Well, my face turned out to be far more asymmetric, which I had to have corrected with a genioplasty. I'm not going to post pictures though.
What are the chances of the nerve being in the way? Is it relatively rare or common? I suppose there's no way around it if the nerve hangs low..?
That would be quite rare indeed.
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let's make some real talk:
Chin wing, to me, has been a LIFE SAVING procedure. It was my LAST RESORT and i'm not joking, i was ready to launch my subhuman pea sized face & me out of the window if it didn't work.
IT DID.
Sure, i was asymmetric before (though it was less noticeable because my jaw was pea sized) and yeah, i stayed a bit asymmetric.
My chin was asymmetric too!
Guess what???
I got another chin wing. Results after the second chin wing were close to perfect. I got fillers on top by a wonderful doc. for bony contours (not sure if he is AS good to fill for other s**t as i believe each doctor is good in something, but i will try shortly some fillers with him in my under eye area, at least some more than last time where i mainly focused in my jaw/chin) and the results where not close to, but just perfect. 100% what i wanted since the beginning of this motherf**king journey that lasted 1020120 decades. 4 world wars occured in this period.
Manteinance requires repeating these fillers 2 or 3 times per year. I am 4 month post fillers and results are holding at 80%. I'll repeat the fillers in 1 month, at the 5 month mark....
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StupidJaws where did you get fillers? I'm thinking of tear trough fillers. I have a strong chin after DJS & genio but midface lacks. Also bags under my eyes are bad
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I had bone grafted on top of my cheekbones by dr. Van der Dussen, alongside a malar fat pad resuspension. This to address the under-eye hollowing and general flat midface. In the same surgery he also performed a genioplasty since dr. Z's chin wing ultimately made my chin too long and asymmetric. Looks good so far, but I'm only 2,5 weeks post-op, so there's still swelling.
I remember your posts from the other forum. I spoke to Dr van der dussen last yr...for some reason he doesn't want to operate on me. He says " he doesn't believe he can make me happy"?? This is after making all these suggestions for what he could do for me and that I should wait six months before seeing him again.
So I take it he harvested your bone for the cheek graft, was this just for anterior projection or lateral? Also with the fat pad re suspension, does he add volume in addition or does he do something else for anterior projection?
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I had bone grafted on top of my cheekbones by dr. Van der Dussen, alongside a malar fat pad resuspension. This to address the under-eye hollowing and general flat midface. In the same surgery he also performed a genioplasty since dr. Z's chin wing ultimately made my chin too long and asymmetric. Looks good so far, but I'm only 2,5 weeks post-op, so there's still swelling.
I had the rhino done by dr. De Jong here in the Netherlands. It's an improvement, but it needs some further fine-tuning. I will see him later this month.
this sounds like a really interesting procedure. i want high projecting cheekbones. do you think this procedure would help?
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i ve found out also at the ortognatica roma{dr. Ramieri ) also the chin wings procedures are performed.
Have somebody undergone surgery there?