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General Category => General Chat => Topic started by: StudyHacks on September 05, 2019, 10:47:54 PM

Title: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: StudyHacks on September 05, 2019, 10:47:54 PM
Sorry this is a stupid question but no google search has answered this question yet. Can anyone please tell me?
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: Daedalus on September 06, 2019, 12:01:30 AM
Chin wing rotates and moves your chin and a lower portion of the mandible without moving the teeth. A genioplasty on the other hand, provides only the movement of the chin.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: StudyHacks on September 06, 2019, 12:41:24 AM
By lower portion of the mandible you mean the gonial angles?
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: Daedalus on September 06, 2019, 02:56:48 AM
It can indeed create an illusion of a sharper gonial angle. The whole idea behind this procedure is to make lower half more define and robust through angulation.  See attachment below.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: ben from UK on September 06, 2019, 05:28:24 AM
The theory behind cw is: by lowering the lower mandible border, it could create more jawangle than before, for example if you have a very steep jawangle. Sometimes they combine cw with horizontal movement of the jaw border, but this is more tricky, cause doing this depends on bone elasticity and sometimes it can go wrong.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: StudyHacks on September 06, 2019, 07:41:38 AM
Where's the lower mandibular border?
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: Post bimax on September 06, 2019, 07:44:14 AM
Where's the lower mandibular border?

Honestly are you f**king blind
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: kavan on September 06, 2019, 03:10:43 PM
Where's the lower mandibular border?

az Isten faszán.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: ben from UK on September 07, 2019, 02:47:07 AM
See pic.

If it succeeds, the result can be nice and natural. But there are dangers like asymmetry. You really need a very very good surgeon with lots of experience to do it right. Even then, things can go wrong.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: PloskoPlus on September 07, 2019, 04:24:37 AM
See pic.

If it succeeds, the result can be nice and natural. But there are dangers like asymmetry. You really need a very very good surgeon with lots of experience to do it right. Even then, things can go wrong.
Looks like a jaw surgery case. Terrible lip posture.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: StudyHacks on September 07, 2019, 06:10:30 AM
Looks like a jaw surgery case. Terrible lip posture.
Oh I see, so basically its main purpose is to lower the gonial angle? Coz that's the difference I can see

az Isten faszán.
Are you Hungarian or did you use google translate for that?  ;D
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: ben from UK on September 07, 2019, 06:33:53 AM
Oh I see, so basically its main purpose is to lower the gonial angle? Coz that's the difference I can see

Yes, but lowering the back of the jaw can give the face a broader jaw (from the front), or at least that perception. Because the golonial angle will be placed lower, so it will be more square instead of for example triangle or oval (at least that's the idea and goal behind it).

If you want additional horizontal augmentation, sometimes they push part of the lower jaw bone to the exterior along with the normal chinwing. This is what Stupidjaws did (and he also did boneshaving) but it's a tricky procedure cause you don't know how much bone elasticity you have. If the bone breaks into pieces during surgery you'll need implants to fix the lack of jawangles (which is an additional procedure, more scar tissue, additional costs, anxiety, depression, etc.). Also, it's more prone to asymmetrical results, especially if your face is already asymmetrical. And of course there are the usual other risks like resorbtion of the graft that is used (usually hipgraft) to fill the 'gaps' and damage of the nerve. The younger you are, the better the chances of having small or no complications.

Quote
Looks like a jaw surgery case. Terrible lip posture.

Yeah true
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: StudyHacks on September 07, 2019, 07:56:56 AM
Yes, but lowering the back of the jaw can give the face a broader jaw (from the front), or at least that perception. Because the golonial angle will be placed lower, so it will be more square instead of for example triangle or oval (at least that's the idea and goal behind it).

If you want additional horizontal augmentation, sometimes they push part of the lower jaw bone to the exterior along with the normal chinwing. This is what Stupidjaws did (and he also did boneshaving) but it's a tricky procedure cause you don't know how much bone elasticity you have. If the bone breaks into pieces during surgery you'll need implants to fix the lack of jawangles (which is an additional procedure, more scar tissue, additional costs, anxiety, depression, etc.). Also, it's more prone to asymmetrical results, especially if your face is already asymmetrical. And of course there are the usual other risks like resorbtion of the graft that is used (usually hipgraft) to fill the 'gaps' and damage of the nerve. The younger you are, the better the chances of having small or no complications.

Yeah true
Is Brusco a good surgeon for that? Or Triaca? Would they mess up my chinwing?

https://imgur.com/a/yDP0EKd

If I not only want a wider (from the front) but a "longer" mandible and maxilla (more forward projected as mines are recessed), should I go with a bimax or rather something like chinwing+boneshaving+chin implant with 6-7mm chin projection?
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: ben from UK on September 07, 2019, 08:24:48 AM
Is Brusco a good surgeon for that? Or Triaca? Would they mess up my chinwing?

https://imgur.com/a/yDP0EKd

If I not only want a wider (from the front) but a "longer" mandible and maxilla (more forward projected as mines are recessed), should I go with a bimax or rather something like chinwing+boneshaving+chin implant with 6-7mm chin projection?

I don't think you need cw. Your golonial angle seems ok.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: kavan on September 07, 2019, 09:17:45 AM

Are you Hungarian or did you use google translate for that?  ;D

Ősi római szobor vagyok a Scarbantia-ból.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: kavan on September 07, 2019, 09:30:05 AM
Looks like a jaw surgery case. Terrible lip posture.

Ya, it just looks like it exaggerated what looks like some 'lantern chin' going on.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: StudyHacks on September 07, 2019, 09:58:29 AM
Ősi római szobor vagyok a Scarbantia-ból.
Értettem Mester ;D

I don't think you need cw. Your golonial angle seems ok.
I've read 120 degrees is ideal and mine isn't 120 degrees as far as I know. But ok.

Anyway do you think I'd get that side profile (provided in the morph) with a bimax? I've consulted with Eppley and he said I couldn't make my mandible more forward projected with a bimax. That goes against everything I've read about jaws recession and the fixing thereof.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: ben from UK on September 07, 2019, 10:23:37 AM
Értettem Mester ;D
I've read 120 degrees is ideal and mine isn't 120 degrees as far as I know. But ok.

Anyway do you think I'd get that side profile (provided in the morph) with a bimax? I've consulted with Eppley and he said I couldn't make my mandible more forward projected with a bimax. That goes against everything I've read about jaws recession and the fixing thereof.

I don't know. I don't know why Eppley said that. He probably wants to sell you and implant or something like that.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: kavan on September 07, 2019, 11:11:56 AM
Értettem Mester ;D


Örülök, hogy azt tudod.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: InvisalignOnly on September 08, 2019, 07:25:46 AM
Örülök, hogy azt tudod.

Just spotted all the Hungarian jokes! It so happens that I am Hungarian, even though I have not lived there since childhood, but I speak the language. The reason I am mentioning it is that I have actually been considering whether I should get my double jaw surgery done there. I am sure it would be a lot cheaper than the other options I am considering (UK, Germany, Spain).

I am just worried that the doctors in Hungary might not have much experience with this type of surgery, seeing it is a small country and they probably do not see that many cases, might not use the latest technology etc. Still, if you or anybody happens to know a maxillofacial surgeon in Hungary they can recommend, I would be grateful for the suggestion!
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: kavan on September 08, 2019, 10:01:47 AM
Just spotted all the Hungarian jokes! It so happens that I am Hungarian, even though I have not lived there since childhood, but I speak the language. The reason I am mentioning it is that I have actually been considering whether I should get my double jaw surgery done there. I am sure it would be a lot cheaper than the other options I am considering (UK, Germany, Spain).

I am just worried that the doctors in Hungary might not have much experience with this type of surgery, seeing it is a small country and they probably do not see that many cases, might not use the latest technology etc. Still, if you or anybody happens to know a maxillofacial surgeon in Hungary they can recommend, I would be grateful for the suggestion!

Dental work was certainly cheaper, advanced and of excellent quality for  before 1989. Thing was that the low cost was due to exchange rates where Western currency would buy a lot more during Communism. People from all over Europe, especially Germany and Austria would flock there for dental work. So, there is precedent for good dental. It's 'a small country' due to loss of much territory after 2 world wars. Austria-Hungary was once a large empire and there is precedent for medical advances. However, no idea who the top maxfax guys are there. Just know that department of Maxillofacial Surgery at Semmelweis University and doctors there have handled serious cases and teach about maxfax surgery. Semmelweis University is a medical and health science university that's 250 years old.
Title: Re: What does a Chin Wing Osteotomy do vs a Traditional Genio?
Post by: InvisalignOnly on September 08, 2019, 10:51:21 AM
Just know that department of Maxillofacial Surgery at Semmelweis University and doctors there have handled serious cases and teach about maxfax surgery. Semmelweis University is a medical and health science university that's 250 years old.

Thanks for your input, you gave me some food for thought! Will contact the university this week and if anything comes out of it, will share it on the forum.