jawsurgeryforums.com
General Category => General Chat => Topic started by: GJ on September 16, 2015, 10:34:54 AM
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I'm going to sticky this thread so we can have a go to place for all the most up to date medical advancements.
Let's do it this way:
Post what advancement you are interested in and ask people who come across new information about it to post links here. Don't clutter the thread with arguments or speculation (discussion is fine so long as it's on point -- relevant info about breakthroughs). Otherwise the thread becomes too difficult to navigate if it's pages of people arguing about their theories or speculating.
If any of you guys come across articles about regenerating teeth, gum, bone using stem cells or a related method, please share the link. I found articles about it dating back almost ten years, yet still nothing seems on the horizon despite most papers saying it's on the horizon.
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Great idea. I'm primarily interested right now in gum tissue regeneration and black triangle fixes. Heard collagen is a good treatment to plump up gum tissue and something called IMOGAIN which available from periodontists now.
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Rapid Resorbable Fixation System
(http://www.synthes.com/sites/NA/Products/Biomaterials/PublishingImages/RapidSorb.jpg)
The Synthes Rapid Resorbable Fixation System consists of resorbable plates, meshes, screws, and tacks for craniofacial reconstruction. The implants are manufactured from 85:15 poly(L-lactide-co-glycolide). This polymer is readily resorbed by the body in 12 months.
Key Features & Benefits
Resorbs in 12 months
Degrades without late inflammatory complications and foreign-body responses that have been observed with semi-crystalline structures such as poly(L-lactide)
Eliminates concerns for potential migration and translocation associated with metallic implants
Eliminates secondary surgeries for implant removal
Radiolucent polymer does not interfere with intra- or postoperative radiographs
Indications*
Intended for use in fracture repair and reconstructive procedures of the craniofacial skeleton in pediatric and adult populations.
Resorbable meshes, sheets, screws and tacks may be used in non-load-bearing applications for maintaining the relative position of, and/or containing bony fragments, bone grafts (autograft or allograft), or bone graft substitutes in reconstruction of the craniofacial or mandibular areas.
http://www.synthes.com/sites/NA/Products/Biomaterials/PorousPolyethyleneImplants/Pages/Rapid-Resorbable-Fixation-System.aspx (http://www.synthes.com/sites/NA/Products/Biomaterials/PorousPolyethyleneImplants/Pages/Rapid-Resorbable-Fixation-System.aspx)
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This looks promising, but I wonder why my perio isn't raving about it?
He does use it however. In fact I found my current perio --who can't do anythign really till braces are off by contacting an emdogain representative.
http://www.straumann.us/en/professionals/products-and-solutions/regeneration-solutions/tissue-regeneration.html
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By the way I contacted the scientist Paul Shapre directly responsible for the following research:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgLzporIRb8
as well as this doctor
http://www.ivanhoe.com/channels/p_channelstory.cfm?storyid=29325
Out of the two I think Paul Sharpe is the world's leading researcher on the matter, but there's a doctor at columbia also advanced in the field.
All of them responded to my utter amazement the very next day.
I asked Paul Sharpe if bioteeth would be available by 2020.
His response: "Impossible to say, but I doubt that early."
Dr. Peter Murray: "I've given up on predictions. No idea. In a sense, stem cells are always activated when your body recovers from an injury" Don't know what the hell that means.
So I mean doesn't sound like it'll be soon. That said, there are teams around the world working on this s**t. Also, breakthroughs in hydrogels for healing look promising. And ultrasound with emdogain and stem cell injections could all help.
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If any of you guys come across articles about regenerating teeth, gum, bone using stem cells or a related method, please share the link. I found articles about it dating back almost ten years, yet still nothing seems on the horizon despite most papers saying it's on the horizon.
I'm afraid what you'll get here is more of the same. I looked up an article on peripheral nerve regeneration from fat cells (my damn paraesthesia!). It droned on and on about exciting results... until I realised it was all experiments on lab animals. I work in a biomed company (not directly involved with the biology stuff, however). My takeaway from it is that progress is a matter of massive amounts of trial and error experiments - just brute force to find stuff that works.
I'm afraid we need another World War to see rapid progress in medicine.
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http://www.jicdro.org/article.asp?issn=2231-0754;year=2010;volume=2;issue=2;spage=86;epage=91;aulast=Surana
great stuff.
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also good stuff is you scroll down to how stem cells are used in periodontal generation.
guys this stuff has been experimentally demonstrated to work. It's around the corner, trust. me. I've reading a lot on this stuff now and it works.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3303525/
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This is coming soon too. And it's proven to WORK. Guys the future is bright, just give it around 5 years. And we'll look better and younger with real new teeth!
http://www.seas.harvard.edu/news/2014/05/researchers-use-light-to-coax-stem-cells-to-repair-teeth
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Another technology that is shown to work. Would love some help deciphering the language here. How much improvement was achieved?
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23533047
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Rapid Resorbable Fixation System - it's nothing new.... it's on the market for many years. Surgeon use this system mostly in children
I wonder why they use 'rapid' word. 12 months is not rapid.
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Screw fixation. Seriously, it's barbaric. There's a startup in Boston - right now - that has a resorbable bone cement. Their Youtube video shows the stuff holding hundreds of pounds of pressure. Combine that with lab grown bone, also being commercially developed right now, and you've got a revolution in craniofacial surgery. It sucks but you just can't keep waiting for the next best thing :(
Ten years ago, osteotomies thinned but now we can augment them. Ten years from now, no plates and you can return to a normal diet in 2-3 weeks. Also, you'll get a few different cuts and everything will be perfect, even your average surgeon down the street can do it in his sleep because it'll all be automated by companies like braces are today. It makes me so sad that I have to spend the next 50 years of my life with the compromises of the s**tty surgery available today. It's also possible that none of this stuff pans out or that it doesn't arrive as quickly and it takes 20 years to get there, not 10.
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Screw fixation. Seriously, it's barbaric. There's a startup in Boston - right now - that has a resorbable bone cement. Their Youtube video shows the stuff holding hundreds of pounds of pressure. Combine that with lab grown bone, also being commercially developed right now, and you've got a revolution in craniofacial surgery. It sucks but you just can't keep waiting for the next best thing :(
Ten years ago, osteotomies thinned but now we can augment them. Ten years from now, no plates and you can return to a normal diet in 2-3 weeks. Also, you'll get a few different cuts and everything will be perfect, even your average surgeon down the street can do it in his sleep because it'll all be automated by companies like braces are today. It makes me so sad that I have to spend the next 50 years of my life with the compromises of the s**tty surgery available today. It's also possible that none of this stuff pans out or that it doesn't arrive as quickly and it takes 20 years to get there, not 10.
If it has not been demonstrated on human subjects, simply ignore it completely.
BTW, a friend of mine who knows a thing or two about bio med, says that stem cells are to biology what the aether was to physics 100 years. There is a good chance that they don't exist at all. Tissue scaffolds hold far more promise.
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If it has not been demonstrated on human subjects, simply ignore it completely.
BTW, a friend of mine who knows a thing or two about bio med, says that stem cells are to biology what the aether was to physics 100 years. There is a good chance that they don't exist at all. Tissue scaffolds hold far more promise.
It's been tested in animals and they are "pre-clinical" right now. I think you may be right, even if it all works out and they roll it out quickly by the time surgeons have figured out how to best make use of it and enough data has been collected to gamble with my life on it, well that's at least 5 years away maybe closer to 10. The gains will be offset by damage to my mouth and joints in the mean time.
Yeah my feeling on stem cells is that they won't be of much use in practice until scientists can figure out how to collect them as part of the procedure or the government figures out how to save them in scale. There's just no incentive for companies to develop technologies for using them when only tens of thousands of people have them banked.
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If it has not been demonstrated on human subjects, simply ignore it completely.
BTW, a friend of mine who knows a thing or two about bio med, says that stem cells are to biology what the aether was to physics 100 years. There is a good chance that they don't exist at all. Tissue scaffolds hold far more promise.
Does she mean they don't exist, or they don't work? They definitely exist.
http://mmqb.si.com/2014/07/30/stem-cell-treatment-nfl-sports-medicine
There's a huge incentive in sports medicine to get star players back on the field sooner, so that is likely why and where the breakthroughs will occur.
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Having lots of acid damage form years of reflux, what's the story on regenerating enamel? LLLP mentioned earlier was only for dentin. Massive need for old people, I'm happy to ride the wave.
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Rapid Resorbable Fixation System
(http://www.synthes.com/sites/NA/Products/Biomaterials/PublishingImages/RapidSorb.jpg)
That looks great. What's the strength like though? Lots of studies showing they aren't great for jaw surgery. A few say they're ok but surgeons I met said all theirs were repeat surgeries. Anecdotes from orthopaedic surgeons about incomplete degradation and difficulty removing partially degraded hardware. Interesting to see them note migration as a risk of fixation, something I always speculated about.
Do we know of anyone that actually uses this stuff?
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A last post about bio-teeth (http://newsstand.bcd.tamhsc.edu/regenerative-medicine-in-dentistry-making-strides-toward-a-bio-tooth/). Sorry to say but not anytime soon :(
“With tooth regeneration, the problem is not in the crown, it’s in the root,” says Dr. Jerry Feng, professor of biomedical sciences at Texas A&M University Baylor College of Dentistry. “You can easily make a crown, but you can’t easily make a root.”
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“To regenerate the whole tooth, we have a long way to go — years, if not decades,” says Feng.
Dentists on Reddit discussed this topic at one point, they were saying a century if not more. It's hard for me to believe, just wow. I guess when you think about it, getting all these layers of cells, ligaments, nerves, stem cells, etc to arrange in the proper places and surviving not only development but implantation. I guess that's a tall order but their predictions also seem pessimistic, we can't really foresee past 10-20 years in the future. Teeth may indeed be centuries away but I'm certain that in 20 years, we'll have solved problems that were at this time thought to be centuries away too. Teeth or otherwise.
The article brings up a related point however. We take crowns for granted these days but they're not ideal either. All things being equal, better to keep your original crowns. If it's not hard to generate a natural crown, then that has huge implications today as well. My entire mouth basically needs crowns at this point and many of us need them for aesthetic reasons as we age too. Would be great if they could at least bring this to market soon, ideally before all mine are done. I'll only be doing the molars to start.
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I'm relatively fair-skinned and I'm really careful about my sun exposure. Living in San Diego I often have to be prepared when I go anywhere during the day with sunblock, headband, and sun gloves. Lol, most people, friends and family included think I'm nuts. I wear gloves when I drive for christ sakes :p but I still spend a good amount of time outdoors hiking, trail running, etc. To make sure I still get vitamin d, I trail run shirtless (my torso doesn't have as much sun exposure over the years so it can afford to soak up some rays) but still wear my sun gloves and headband and sunblock on my face. I also only use physical sunblock (zinc oxide) because while it looks kinda obvious, its safe and really effective against uva and uvb rays. When I was about 14 I saw a tv special about skin cancer that made a strong impression on me and I've been conscious of sun exposure ever since. My habits and techniques of minimizing sun exposure have evolved over the years as ive learned more. I know I sound crazy but I'm around older people all the time who did not protect their skin from the sun in their youth and look much older than their calendar age.
In any case, the reason I brought this up is because I was reading about this fern extract that provides sun protection in the form of a supplement. It's not a ton of protection but it's another line of defense in daily uv protection. I don't use it as I just recently found out about it but it intrigues me:
http://www.ifcgroup.net/fernblock (http://www.ifcgroup.net/fernblock)
I'd be interested to see scientific advancements in this area that make avoiding sun exposure less tedious.
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I'm also really interested in this:
http://www.technologyreview.com/news/534636/the-anti-aging-pill/ (http://www.technologyreview.com/news/534636/the-anti-aging-pill/)
Not sure if this thread was only supposed to be about craniofacial advances but I figured I'd share anyway :)
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You are crazy lol! But it's still cool, gives you character. I'd been using Neutrogena moisturizer since early teens, mostly because I needed something after shaving and that's what my mom gave me. It happens to have contained sun block so my skin has aged relatively well. Despite my facial deformities, people (and that fancy new Microsoft service) consistently guess that I'm about 5 years younger than I actually am. That and having a tendency to hide indoors. I don't blame you but you should know that the vast majority of your long term risks were established before you had the ability to alter them, that is by your parents. I try to educate my kids friends parents about the importance of sun protection in the first few months of life especially if not the first few years but they rarely seem to heed my advice. The damage is multiplied by the number of replications and affects your body for longer than later life exposure.
The post about anti-aging pills is cool if it's insane to take a pill because it worked on a worm in a lab. FDA regulations exist for good reason. I understand their hesitancy about waiting for that proof but OTOH they're asking for miracle in not only hitting the right targets for aging but also dosage, patient selection, etc. Side effects are very difficult to anticipate even when many multiples of funding are thrown at new pharmaceuticals and this could potentially be taken at large doses over a very extended period of time. I can only imagine the impact if people start giving this stuff to their kids and they continue it through life. I hope it's excluded for that purpose. Better approach would be to find it naturally in whole food and add a significant component of that to your regular diet, it's been load tested by nature for you.
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I definitely agree about the anti-aging pill. It's tough to know the risks associated with isolating various antioxidant compounds and super-concentrating them without their (theoretically) whole food vehicles. A good reason why I haven't started taking them.
I'll have to respectfully disagree with you guys about sun exposure in youth being the deviding factor in skin cancer risk. From everything I've read that, that theory has been largely debunked. That's not to say that young people cannot get skin cancer; they can and do, but (again, ftom numerous dermatological studies ive read) lifetime damage/risk is cumulative so it's never too late to minimize your risk.
Also as far as premature aging goes, sun exposure without a doubt plays a big role. Steve Nicks stated in an interview that she hasn't laid out in the sun since she was 28 and often lived a nocturnal lifestyle for many years and looks incredible for her current age compared to her peers. I personally wouldn't go so far as to completely avoid the sun because we do need some, but you need to be strategic about your exposure. Face, neck, and hands have thinner skin and were most likely exposed and forgotten about in youth than the back, for example. Some people can get away with more sun than others too; unfortunately I'm fair skinned with ginger genes so I don't have much leeway, but conversely, I don't need much sun to make an adequate amount of vitamin d.
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They're basically just gloves with a really tight weave to block out uv rays. I use these when hiking/driving:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00V5RXULS/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?qid=1447774466&sr=8-2&pi=SX200_QL40&keywords=sun+gloves&dpPl=1&dpID=41gVw8OJxcL&ref=plSrch (http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00V5RXULS/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?qid=1447774466&sr=8-2&pi=SX200_QL40&keywords=sun+gloves&dpPl=1&dpID=41gVw8OJxcL&ref=plSrch)
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I'll have to respectfully disagree with you guys about sun exposure in youth being the deviding factor in skin cancer risk. From everything I've read that, that theory has been largely debunked. That's not to say that young people cannot get skin cancer; they can and do, but (again, ftom numerous dermatological studies ive read) lifetime damage/risk is cumulative so it's never too late to minimize your risk.
Hasn't been of special interest to me but sounds like it to you so I'd defer to your research here. What you wrote is different than what I'd read however, which is that lifetime risk of cancer was dominated by early exposure rather than specifically childhood skin cancer. That is, if you got skin cancer when you were 60 the bulk of the risk could be traced back to when you were a kid. There are similar risk factors for radiation as well, a cat scan at 30 is 4x as risky as one at 60 and same for childhood radiation. Confounding factors are big too of course. Anyway, good to know it's not too late for me cause it runs in the family and I grew up in a place where there's a lot of sun!!
unfortunately I'm fair skinned with ginger genes so I don't have much leeway, but conversely, I don't need much sun to make an adequate amount of vitamin d.
If I were you, then I'd be more concerned about your lack of a soul than your odds of skin cancer. /s
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That is really interesting about the cat scan risk. Logically I would deduce the opposite; that in youth your body can withstand more and recover more fully than in old age. similar to how what we eat doesnt have as big of an effect on our body in youth versus middle to old age. Could you link where you read that when u have time?
And haha thanks for the no soul comment :P
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Guys, please stay on topic in this thread not the place for theories and expounding because that can sidetrack the thread quickly. If an idea in this thread excites you and you want to discuss, just make a new thread about it. Thanks.
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My bad.
This is somewhat older news now but they can grow tmjs in a lab: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/03/100330152437.htm (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/03/100330152437.htm)
Im really curious to see how jaw surgeons will utilize this technology in the future for condylar resorption patients. My tmjs shrunk considerably post surgery and it'd be great if they could use a firm of this technology to increase the size of the condylar head.
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My doc says to wait for stem cells but I dont think I can wait.
The question is once grown or attached, I wonder if it can somehow inherit the disease process and resorb...
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My doc says to wait for stem cells but I dont think I can wait.
Did he say how long a wait that would be?
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Did he say how long a wait that would be?
EpiBone says they're 7 years from first clinical trials which means 10 years from initial applications, optimistically. That's just a small piece of bone. Cartilage and other tissues are in the same stage of development and I'd guess they'd have their own applications hit the market at the same time. Putting them together is an extra, more complicated step. I would give them 5-10 years after that point so in total we're looking at 10-20 years for early adopters.
The good news is there's A LOT of pressure to push this stuff to market. Remember, it's not just TMJs at stake but all joints. That's a HUGE market.
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Good evening,
I am Lestat.
I have heard about a now method of growing human bones outside the Body, using 3d Technology.
Maybe in a few years it is possible to grow bones from our own stem cells!
The Company is called EpiBone an her technique is surprisingly simple. A CT scan is taken of the patient’s damaged bone, and a 3D model is created. That 3D model is used to CNC mill an animal – usually cow – bone into the exact shape of the graft that needs to be implanted into the patient. Then, fat cells are taken from the patient, and stem cells from the fat are isolated. (Stem cells from fat are capable of growing into many other different forms of tissue, which makes them ideal for this process.) Those stem cells are placed into a bioreactor with the milled animal bone; the idea is that they will grow around the bone, essentially engulfing it – when the bioreactor is opened, a new bone comprised of the patient’s own cells will be ready for implant. Once it’s implanted, it continues to grow and merge with the bone around it.
In the 19th century, it would have seemed inconceivable that bacterial infections could one day be killed off with a simple pill, but antibiotics would be arriving soon. Today, most people would say that growing real human body parts is impossible, but we’re starting to learn that that’s not the case.
Take a look at their website.
I think there is at least new hope for us! Think of all the possibilities, higher cheekbones, wider jaws, and everything permanent without disadvantages.
Would it not be great?
Lestat
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Unless this is in advanced stage of human clinical trial, i don't see how it's coming out any time soon.
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Unless this is in advanced stage of human clinical trial, i don't see how it's coming out any time soon.
In a youtube video featuring epibone technology they said 8 years, so yeah not soon. Seems promising.
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This looks like it could at least help a bit:
http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2016/02/09/new-medical-procedure-uses-patients-blood-cells-to-restore-gums/
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This looks like it could at least help a bit:
http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2016/02/09/new-medical-procedure-uses-patients-blood-cells-to-restore-gums/
This looks interesting.
Can you guys working with a periodontist ask about it?
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http://motherboard.vice.com/read/an-alzheimers-drug-could-help-grow-teeth-and-fight-cavities?utm_source=dmfb
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http://motherboard.vice.com/read/an-alzheimers-drug-could-help-grow-teeth-and-fight-cavities?utm_source=dmfb
That's pretty interesting. Seems far from the mainstream, and it would probably be hard to find someone willing to do it on a patient. Wonder what the long-term affects of it are, too.
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That's pretty interesting. Seems far from the mainstream, and it would probably be hard to find someone willing to do it on a patient. Wonder what the long-term affects of it are, too.
I actually once messaged Paul Sharpe and asked him about his previous research which involved producing "bioteeth" --I asked him if it might be available by 2020 and he even responded saying he doubted it would be here that soon --but maybe with this new research it's possible?
The truth is my major problem began when I had my tooth extractions --even after jaw surgery my arches are way too small to adequately allow my tongue to sit within them so I bite on my tongue all day and move it around in my mouth.
It's cause so much anxiety i just want to scream out loud ALL THE f**kING TIME. If there were any way to solve this problem I would be the happiest man on the world. extractions ruin your f**king face. If there are bioteeth i would get the original spaces opened --which would probably require grafting massive jaw bone --i'm not waiting for two years for braces to do it, I mean actually just replacing all the teeth --seriously. If you told me they could do that by 2020 even I'd convert to your religion --I suppose that's the religion of science.....
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And what about Wilckodontics?
See the video:
http://videos.dr-brusco.ch/en/wilckodontics/
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And what about Wilckodontics?
See the video:
http://videos.dr-brusco.ch/en/wilckodontics/
wickodontics is nothing new --just supposedly faster braces which I doubt.
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I forget if I posted this already: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2017/01/09/end-fillings-sight-scientists-find-alzheimers-drug-makes-teeth/
It seems we keep hearing about this being right around the corner, yet it never hits the market.
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I forget if I posted this already: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2017/01/09/end-fillings-sight-scientists-find-alzheimers-drug-makes-teeth/
It seems we keep hearing about this being right around the corner, yet it never hits the market.
So I actually spoke to a professor periodontics today and asked him a ton of questions. Nothing can be done for black triangles except lengthening crowns and masking the problem --which is just a trap for bacteria so f**k that. And this is a guy involved in university research in regenerative medicine.
I'm sure multiple people are working on this but he said for clinical applications 2030 at the very earliest. I think that's about right. I'll be well into middle age, but I'll still care how my teeth look and their function. So I'm just going to maintain what I have and learn to live with it. It's not going to be easy, but I have to accept orthodontics and extractions ruined my gum tissue and the look of my teeth.
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Yeah all this stuff (gum regeneration, stem cell teeth, etc) is always is 20-30years away, yet the articles make them seem right around the corner.
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Yeah all this stuff (gum regeneration, stem cell teeth, etc) is always is 20-30years away, yet the articles make them seem right around the corner.
I'd say it will be around in 10 years honestly, I think that's optimistic but possible. Dum spiro spero. As long as I breathe, I hope.
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This is awesome, If it becomes reality. No more nerve damage or other tissue damage
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2017/08/07/miracle-device-can-heal-single-touch-and-even-repair-brain-injuries/537326001/
A new device developed at The Ohio State University can start healing organs in a "fraction of a second," researchers say.
The technology, known as Tissue Nanotransfection (TNT), has the potential to save the lives of car crash victims and even deployed soldiers injured on site. It's a dime-sized silicone chip that "injects genetic code into skin cells, turning those skin cells into other types of cells required for treating diseased conditions," according to a release.
In lab tests, one touch of TNT completely repaired injured legs of mice over three weeks by turning skin cells into vascular cells.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2017/08/07/miracle-device-can-heal-single-touch-and-even-repair-brain-injuries/537326001/
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I'm fairly pumped about this company (PolarityTE), who just got registered/approved by the FDA for their skinTE technology. Basically they have proven total scarless skin regeneration (all layers + hair). They will be starting trials on more extreme cases by the end of the year. Their roadmap also includes nerve/capillary/fat/bone regeneration in the coming years.
https://globenewswire.com/news-release/2017/10/03/1140038/0/en/PolarityTE-Announces-FDA-Registration-of-Lead-Product-SkinTE.html
Biotech is growing fast lately!
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Yeah it looks promising. The hair loss 2020 blog covers them a lot. I think it's entering stage 3 though? Odds of success at this point are still only about 30%.
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I'm fairly pumped about this company (PolarityTE), who just got registered/approved by the FDA for their skinTE technology. Basically they have proven total scarless skin regeneration (all layers + hair). They will be starting trials on more extreme cases by the end of the year. Their roadmap also includes nerve/capillary/fat/bone regeneration in the coming years.
https://globenewswire.com/news-release/2017/10/03/1140038/0/en/PolarityTE-Announces-FDA-Registration-of-Lead-Product-SkinTE.html
Biotech is growing fast lately!
Nope this company is a scam/not gonna happen. Forget the speculation, I've looked at the technology, it's all pie in the sky. All they have is something to help burns heal --just like recell but a bit more involved. It's not gonna help anything cosmetic for decades, even if it does end up working eventually. They're jsut creating buzz for VC money so they can have cushy jobs for the next several years. Most companies are like this.
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This is a bit old, and I'm not sure if we touched on it already, but huge $ saver if we can print braces soon.
https://www.sciencealert.com/a-college-student-has-3d-printed-his-own-braces-for-less-than-60
I wouldn't want to do that myself, but say an ortho gives you a CAD file and you bring it home and 3D print it...
Of course orthos are scared and bashing it: https://www.thestar.com.my/tech/tech-news/2018/02/28/3d-printed-braces-cut-orthodontia-costs-but-dentists-say-theyre-not-worth-it/
The truth seems to lie somewhere in between. Orthos should be 3D printing these for patients for a few hundred bucks. There is no reason to be paying an ortho as much as we do, so hopefully computers step in and bridge that gap.
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For condylar resorption. Only 1 patient, but it's a start.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29625584 (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29625584)
full article https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5889586/ (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5889586/)
BACKGROUND:Upon orthognathic mandibular advancement surgery the adjacent soft tissues can displace the distal bone segment and increase the load on the temporomandibular joint causing loss of its integrity. Remodeling of the condyle and temporal fossa with destruction of condylar cartilage and subchondral bone leads to postsurgical condylar resorption, with arthralgia and functional limitations. Patients with severe lesions are refractory to conservative treatments, leading to more invasive therapies that range from simple arthrocentesis to open surgery and prosthesis. Although aggressive and with a high risk for the patient, surgical invasive treatments are not always efficient in managing the degenerative lesions.
METHODS:We propose a regenerative medicine approach using in-vitro expanded autologous cells from nasal septum applied to the first proof-of-concept patient. After the required quality controls, the cells were injected into each joint by arthrocentesis. Results were monitored by functional assays and image analysis using computed tomography.
RESULTS:The cell injection fully reverted the condylar resorption, leading to functional and structural regeneration after 6 months. Computed tomography images showed new cortical bone formation filling the former cavity space, and a partial recovery of condylar and temporal bones. The superposition of the condyle models showed the regeneration of the bone defect, reconstructing the condyle original form.
CONCLUSIONS:We propose a new treatment of condylar resorption subsequent to orthognathic surgery, presently treated only by alloplastic total joint replacement. We propose an intra-articular injection of autologous in-vitro expanded cells from the nasal septum. The proof-of-concept treatment of a selected patient that had no alternative therapeutic proposal has given promising results, reaching full regeneration of both the condylar cartilage and bone at 6 months after the therapy, which was fully maintained after 1 year. This first case is being followed by inclusion of new patients with a similar pathological profile to complete an ongoing stage I/II study.
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Thanks to the person who shared this elsewhere (you know who you are ;)).
https://medicalxpress.com/news/2018-06-breakthrough-treatment-crippling-jaw-disease.html
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I was gonna say 10, but I predict that within 5 years this technology is gonna be widespread in jaw surgery.
Gunson/Arnett are always keeping abreast of new technology BMP for example and piezosurgery and it won't be long before the holy grail will be reached: engineering actualy jaw bone implants. Theoretically if you had access to all the different practitioners I think you could pull it off NOW, but its all to tentative and be a coherent surgical system yet. Once you we do achieve this, it'll be a new age.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S168785741500027X
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https://futurism.com/the-end-of-scars-scientists-discovered-how-to-regenerate-human-skin/
I just found this news about ending scars and regenerative medicine for skin.
Thoughts everyone? It is 1.5 years old.
Is it vapor ware?
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https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/08/180801115229.htm
Thoughts?
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https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/08/180801115229.htm
Thoughts?
As far as seeing any of this in clinical practice? It's all science fiction for at least another 10-20 years. We were born too early.
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Too optimistic?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwHRjA5L4FA
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Too optimistic?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwHRjA5L4FA
He says they can grow organs.
Where is this happening? A lab?
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He says they can grow organs.
Where is this happening? A lab?
In Lazlo's pants.
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In Lazlo's pants.
lol
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https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/science/next-revolution-dental-care-about-begin-ncna837706
This drug, tideglusib, dates back to 2017 or so, but several articles released this year say it's headed to trials. Something to keep an eye on. Some studies say it can "regrow teeth" and others claim it can only fix cavities. Regrowing teeth would be the huge breakthrough, obviously. A better filling for cavities is good but not that exciting.
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Regeneration and aging research are getting more attention in recent years.
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/04/190425143647.htm (https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/04/190425143647.htm)
I've been following Michael Levin's work recently like with the above example recently released. It gives me hope, but also makes me realize more and more just how ridiculously primitive cosmetic procedures are nowadays (I've totally abandoned this idea personally). If we want to actually look good in the future, this will be how we do it. Just, you know, be ready to wait 15-50 years... still, things are certainly speeding up.
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http://www.cassiopea.com/news-and-media/press-releases/yr-2019/190416.aspx
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http://www.cassiopea.com/news-and-media/press-releases/yr-2019/190416.aspx
now we just need something like this for gum tissue or teeth
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Interesting.
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/05/190516155338.htm
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https://sifted.eu/articles/skeleton-healthtech-startups-3d-printing-bones-particle3d-mimetis-xilloc/
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https://sifted.eu/articles/skeleton-healthtech-startups-3d-printing-bones-particle3d-mimetis-xilloc/
it's a start, but not enough to actually augment facial bones yet. That's probably another 10-20 years away.
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it's a start, but not enough to actually augment facial bones yet. That's probably another 10-20 years away.
-"With positive results, the company expects to start a Phase III US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) trial at the beginning of 2020, with an outcome expected within two-and-a-half years."
https://m.jpost.com/Israel-News/Need-a-bone-Israeli-company-is-growing-them-in-a-lab-596818
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It sounds like it's a ways away (like all these things).
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2019/aug/30/scientists-grow-tooth-enamel
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https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/trf.14836
Last week I had stem cells for the scar tissue and fibrotic tissue from the surgery. I had what is called Wharton/s jelly and it cost a small fortune. This is an article regarding how stem cells work to help with fibrotic scar tissue. Out of surgery my bite hit like a machine gun. I had good overlap and overbite before the surgery, i could not get used to the improper bite. The compression and banging killed my healing ability. Also the follow up surgeries to address an infection that ran though my jaw from a surgical screw killing a tooth caused scarring. My IAN nerve and mental nerve is twisted and compressed and fibrotic. Its like my mouth is frozen in cement.
This is an expensive experiment. The problem in injecting scar tissue that is fibrotic is that stem cells may not survive in fibrotic tissue. So i had half the dose via IV and the other half spun with my blood and injected into the actual oral scar tissue. I am taking weekly pictures. At a week, i notice some softening of the tissue, the nerve is coming on line a bit (and it hurts lol). If this works at all to give me the ability to move my mouth, it will be nothing short of a small miracle. BTW, gunson said to a third party, not to me, that he thinks i have a connective tissue disorder that causes scarring. I don’t have any such condition and have had a couple of previous surgeries and sports injuries and have never had abnormal scarring.
For anyone who is interested, take a look at these photos. They are not clinical, pardon the dirty face and partial lipstick, but its pretty amazing 9 days out.
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Last week I had stem cells for the scar tissue and fibrotic tissue from the surgery.
Did this work?
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Periodically I look up stuff about tooth regeneration.
They have been writing about the same tech since f**king 2006 and even more about certain advancements since 2013! We're almost at 2020. How could f**king science progress so damn slow?
Like wasn't there supposed to be a stem cell revolution and a crispr revolution and lasers and all sorts of s**t? Why has it taken so damn long? I mean like really what's the f**king hold-up?
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Periodically I look up stuff about tooth regeneration.
They have been writing about the same tech since f**king 2006 and even more about certain advancements since 2013! We're almost at 2020. How could f**king science progress so damn slow?
Like wasn't there supposed to be a stem cell revolution and a crispr revolution and lasers and all sorts of s**t? Why has it taken so damn long? I mean like really what's the f**king hold-up?
Fake Christians took over. Bush killed stem cell research. Trump hates science. Etc.
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Fake Christians took over. Bush killed stem cell research. Trump hates science. Etc.
all true.
but with the explosion of global economies and places like asia that have little regulation, things should be picking up there.
i mean if we look at other technology sectors f**king cars, computers, everything gets predictably better and better in game changing and paradigm changing ways every several months.
why hasn't this been happening with medical technology? i mean thinking of the body as a technological system?
i think there are some fundamental hurdles in biological science, but there are game changing innovations like crispr which is just very recent.
i think the biological problems are just too complex for the human mind to hack. we'll need powerful AI's which are on the horizong and once those are let loose to figure out these problems we're going to f**king own this s**t.
the last ten years were pathetic, but i'm certain the next ten years will involve some game changing discoveries that will lead directly to clinical practice.
we need to be able cure baldness, we need to cure grey hair, we need to be able to synhesize things like skin and teeth and bone. all of this will be possible by 2040-2050, i'm certain of it.
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all true.
but with the explosion of global economies and places like asia that have little regulation, things should be picking up there.
i mean if we look at other technology sectors f**king cars, computers, everything gets predictably better and better in game changing and paradigm changing ways every several months.
why hasn't this been happening with medical technology? i mean thinking of the body as a technological system?
i think there are some fundamental hurdles in biological science, but there are game changing innovations like crispr which is just very recent.
i think the biological problems are just too complex for the human mind to hack. we'll need powerful AI's which are on the horizong and once those are let loose to figure out these problems we're going to f**king own this s**t.
the last ten years were pathetic, but i'm certain the next ten years will involve some game changing discoveries that will lead directly to clinical practice.
we need to be able cure baldness, we need to cure grey hair, we need to be able to synhesize things like skin and teeth and bone. all of this will be possible by 2040-2050, i'm certain of it.
Most medical innovation is publicly funded, so what gets developed is almost always a political choice
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Most medical innovation is publicly funded, so what gets developed is almost always a political choice
yeah but china?
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yeah but china?
China is still a third world Country in many respects.
I haven't seen a lot of good scientific research coming out of there, and many wealthy Chinese are still sending their kids to study in the U.S.
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yeah but china?
Is the Chinese government pushing funding in these areas? If not, there's your answer. They could get it done if it was a priority.
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China is still a third world Country in many respects.
I haven't seen a lot of good scientific research coming out of there, and many wealthy Chinese are still sending their kids to study in the U.S.
f**k that's just f**king great. f**king chinese step your game up!!!!!
yeah you're right i keep thinking there's probably some f**king special secret hub of medical advancements but all these cold war countries are f**ked.
gone are the days when Ivan Drago had the latest tech to beat Rocky, russia is a s**thole and so is China probably.
You know where there might be some cool s**t coming from? South Korea since they're so obsessed with looks and plastic surgery.
Come on Korea!!!! Do ya thang!
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This is all so f**king depressing.
I found this article from 2009! Look what they predicted would be the case by 2020!
Here we are at 2020 do we have any of these technologies? Not a single one. f**k science.
Dentists and faggot boomer surgeons just wanna keep plying their medieval trade to fund
their yachts and watch collections. f**k JAW SURGEONS AND DENTISTS AND f**k THE INSTITUTIONS
ENABLING THEM!
https://www.aegisdentalnetwork.com/id/2009/08/transitions-and-changes-between-now-and-year-2020-to-help-shape-future-of-dentistry
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51182451?ns_campaign=bbcnews&ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_source=facebook&ns_mchannel=social&fbclid=IwAR3zwclAqqD37p1UVWA18t50ogEitxfOeqcQaLgG810bvi2vdKSjY8AW4f0&fbclid=IwAR15lE8AhxeQU69qAvUompr8I-zBlMMIdMIIbm0vONu1jhlRiJvH6bs4l4M
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51182451?ns_campaign=bbcnews&ocid=socialflow_facebook&ns_source=facebook&ns_mchannel=social&fbclid=IwAR3zwclAqqD37p1UVWA18t50ogEitxfOeqcQaLgG810bvi2vdKSjY8AW4f0&fbclid=IwAR15lE8AhxeQU69qAvUompr8I-zBlMMIdMIIbm0vONu1jhlRiJvH6bs4l4M
yeah once they remove the "may" from such titles i'll have cause to get excited. so many hair, dental, jaw surgery etc. "science news" always ends with "and scientists MAY ONE DAY use this cure x, y, z" f**k science writing. man, science i've realised is the most corrupt game in town!
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yeah once they remove the "may" from such titles i'll have cause to get excited. so many hair, dental, jaw surgery etc. "science news" always ends with "and scientists MAY ONE DAY use this cure x, y, z" f**k science writing. man, science i've realised is the most corrupt game in town!
Just try not to focus on the sensationalist claims made by publications, they obviously have a vested interest in drawing eyeballs. Would be cool to have a universal 'cure' for cancers though.
Instead focus on the trends. Biotech is really gaining traction in many fields, and it isn't unthinkable to see a boom in the next decade. Human health and longevity is gaining a lot of momentum and is really the next big thing to happen outside of AI (AI itself being one of the missing links in regenerative tech) or renewables, and we've seen a significant splash of startups and massive investments in the field lately. While the stories remain 'decades away', the technology is changing a lot in exciting ways.
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Just try not to focus on the sensationalist claims made by publications, they obviously have a vested interest in drawing eyeballs. Would be cool to have a universal 'cure' for cancers though.
Instead focus on the trends. Biotech is really gaining traction in many fields, and it isn't unthinkable to see a boom in the next decade. Human health and longevity is gaining a lot of momentum and is really the next big thing to happen outside of AI (AI itself being one of the missing links in regenerative tech) or renewables, and we've seen a significant splash of startups and massive investments in the field lately. While the stories remain 'decades away', the technology is changing a lot in exciting ways.
plused 1 you Jusken for your sensible comments
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So i didn't think we were this close to it, but it looks like there are some fascinating things very close on the horizon.
Actually I think the technology already exists, but there are so may regulatory hurdles and s**t to go through it may take 3-5 years to actually have this in a clinical setting --which isn't that long.
Most of this has to do with scaffolds that guide bone regeneration and growth and then resorb in the body --so no need for artificial implants.
And then there's also all the work being done on 3D bioprinting bone grafts and implants.
Just one example, this product from this company that is specifically has a product for jaw and maxillofacial surgeries.
https://tissuesys.com/product-and-market-opportunities/
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There's some incredible stuff going on with Crispr, DaVinci Surgical, and 3D printing. Many technologies are aligning at the same time. We're probably only 5 years out now.
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There's some incredible stuff going on with Crispr, DaVinci Surgical, and 3D printing. Many technologies are aligning at the same time. We're probably only 5 years out now.
It's been around 3 years since this statement. Does it look like we are on track to major technologies going to market in Feb 2025?
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It's been around 3 years since this statement. Does it look like we are on track to major technologies going to market in Feb 2025?
Yes, mostly. Covid set back Davinci quite a bit. The others are on schedule, but I don't know if they will apply to jaw surgery at this point. Probably cutting edge surgeons only.
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Yes, mostly. Covid set back Davinci quite a bit. The others are on schedule, but I don't know if they will apply to jaw surgery at this point. Probably cutting edge surgeons only.
Great to hear! Let's hope that eventually it applies to MaxFac eventually.
When you refer to CRISPR, are you referring to something like Genomic Surgery?:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0RIRsUrgNs
And in which context are you talking about 3D printing? Are you talking about it in the context of implants (Silicone, Medpor, PEEK, etc)?
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Great to hear! Let's hope that eventually it applies to MaxFac eventually.
When you refer to CRISPR, are you referring to something like Genomic Surgery?:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0RIRsUrgNs
And in which context are you talking about 3D printing? Are you talking about it in the context of implants (Silicone, Medpor, PEEK, etc)?
Yeah 3D printing implants. With Crispr, I'm hoping we can modify genes before people develop jaw issues. That is the easiest path. But it might be possible to engineer that gene later in life to grow differently, too. That's a lot tougher, but in theory, it could be possible to turn the gene off that fused bone to begin with, and then via either orthodontics or distraction (in conjunction with robotic surgery) perform a more risk free operation. The latter is more speculative, and I think that pushes it out on the curve more further into the future. Maybe 20 years. This is all happening fast, though. AI was a buzz word just 3 years ago, and now Chatgpt is all the rage. And for good reason. These things are always speculative and cutting edge ideas in the offing for decades, and then they hit a critical point where there's a small breakthrough that brings it as a viable solution on a mass scale. We're close to that point on so many technologies from AI, Quantum Computing, 3D printing, Genomics, and even material science (e.g. graphene) that they likely all merge into a huge technological revolution that touches everything, including the issues we're all dealing with.
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Yeah 3D printing implants. With Crispr, I'm hoping we can modify genes before people develop jaw issues. That is the easiest path. But it might be possible to engineer that gene later in life to grow differently, too. That's a lot tougher, but in theory, it could be possible to turn the gene off that fused bone to begin with, and then via either orthodontics or distraction (in conjunction with robotic surgery) perform a more risk free operation. The latter is more speculative, and I think that pushes it out on the curve more further into the future. Maybe 20 years. This is all happening fast, though. AI was a buzz word just 3 years ago, and now Chatgpt is all the rage. And for good reason. These things are always speculative and cutting edge ideas in the offing for decades, and then they hit a critical point where there's a small breakthrough that brings it as a viable solution on a mass scale. We're close to that point on so many technologies from AI, Quantum Computing, 3D printing, Genomics, and even material science (e.g. graphene) that they likely all merge into a huge technological revolution that touches everything, including the issues we're all dealing with.
Interesting! I hope this comes to fruition and when I'm in my 40s I can finally not look horribly ugly.
Do you mind sharing some keywords of organizations that are working on these (named) innovations / ideas? I'd love to be on the lookout for news and any academic works for these.
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Do you mind sharing some organizations that are working on these (named) innovations / ideas? I'd love to be on the lookout for news and any academic works for these.
Crispr therapeutics, Editas, Intuitive Surgical, Medtronic...come to mind in terms of gene editing and robotic surgery. I'm sure there are more. The graphene companies are mostly small and international, but I bet material companies like 3M et al are on that. The material science technology is here right now; it's just expensive due to the process of isolating the carbon in graphene.
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Crispr therapeutics, Editas, Intuitive Surgical, Medtronic...come to mind in terms of gene editing and robotic surgery. I'm sure there are more. The graphene companies are mostly small and international, but I bet material companies like 3M et al are on that. The material science technology is here right now; it's just expensive due to the process of isolating the carbon in graphene.
Thanks! I'll keep an eye on all of them. :)
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Crispr therapeutics, Editas, Intuitive Surgical, Medtronic...come to mind in terms of gene editing and robotic surgery. I'm sure there are more. The graphene companies are mostly small and international, but I bet material companies like 3M et al are on that. The material science technology is here right now; it's just expensive due to the process of isolating the carbon in graphene.
Question: I am wondering how would CRISPR improve a person's facial structure if they are already born and heck, even well past puberty? i.e. their facial structure is completely developed and done developing?
Or would that not be the use case for it? But rather to work towards making the next generation not look ugly...
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Question: I am wondering how would CRISPR improve a person's facial structure if they are already born and heck, even well past puberty? i.e. their facial structure is completely developed and done developing?
Or would that not be the use case for it? But rather to work towards making the next generation not look ugly...
Or are you talking about something like this?:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7427626/
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Question: I am wondering how would CRISPR improve a person's facial structure if they are already born and heck, even well past puberty?
Ideally by manipulating the gene for jaw growth. It would probably have to be done at a young age, yeah, before the bones fuse, though maybe not necessarily as we learn more about how the genes work. My speculation is that this type of gene editing at a young age will eventually replace braces and surgery. It seems like a natural progression away from the current barbaric methods.
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Ideally by manipulating the gene for jaw growth. It would probably have to be done at a young age, yeah, before the bones fuse, though maybe not necessarily as we learn more about how the genes work. My speculation is that this type of gene editing at a young age will eventually replace braces and surgery. It seems like a natural progression away from the current barbaric methods.
Ah, I guess I'm born in the wrong era. Sad. :(
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It will be interesting to see what the merger of quantum computing and AI over the coming five years produces, in general, but specifically in terms of jaw surgery and dentistry. We're finally on the cusp of technologies that work together in a positive feedback loop that can lead to quicker breakthroughs.