jawsurgeryforums.com
General Category => Aesthetics => Topic started by: protruder on September 27, 2016, 03:37:24 PM
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My maxilla was moved 8 mm forward, my jaw 16 mm forward, all with a CCW movement. now I feel everything protrudes too much. My problem was sleep apnea, which now is gone, but now I'm not pleased with my aesthetic result.
Are those movements common? I haven't seen anyone here with those numbers, they sound huge to me.
If I decide to move back everything in a revision a couple of mm in order to look normal (more like my old self), would that compromise my airway?
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How long ago was surgery? Were teeth extracted beforehand?
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Surgery was more than a year ago. Wisdom teeth removed 3 months pre-op.
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Post some pictures so that we can see what you look like. Then we can let you know if anything is wrong. You can always mask your eyes if you are worried about being recognised. You might be worrying about nothing. We'll tell you if you look good, then you can put your mind to rest.
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I don't really want to show my pics, just want to know if those numbers are huge.
And if I would need bone grafting to recess my maxilla or not.
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My maxilla was moved 8 mm forward, my jaw 16 mm forward, all with a CCW movement. now I feel everything protrudes too much. My problem was sleep apnea, which now is gone, but now I'm not pleased with my aesthetic result.
Are those movements common? I haven't seen anyone here with those numbers, they sound huge to me.
If I decide to move back everything in a revision a couple of mm in order to look normal (more like my old self), would that compromise my airway?
yeah those numbers are huge. who were your surgeons???
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My surgeon is in Europe. I don't want to say his name yet because im not happy with the aesthetic result and I might get a revision.
I think he advanced everything too much, he wanted to cure my sleep apnea but didn't take aesthetics into account. Some of you guys always say that you would like to have had more advancement and that you wished your jaw protruded more, but I don't think it looks good, at least in my case.
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My surgeon is in Europe. I don't want to say his name yet because im not happy with the aesthetic result and I might get a revision.
I think he advanced everything too much, he wanted to cure my sleep apnea but didn't take aesthetics into account. Some of you guys always say that you would like to have had more advancement and that you wished your jaw protruded more, but I don't think it looks good, at least in my case.
You said that women like your face now, so what's the problem? Come on, post a picture and we'll give you a straight answer.
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The problem is that I, MYSELF don't like it.
My chin protrudes past the tip of my nose now.
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1) Strong username to post content
2) I agree that you should post profile picture. I can't count the number of cases I've now read in which the patents are unhappy with good aesthetic outcomes due to distorted perceptions of how their faces should ideally appear. External evaluation is needed.
3) Yes those are relatively large advancements
4) You'd generally only need grafting to fill in large boney gaps, e.g. as when your mandible was advanced 16 mm I guarantee some cadaver bone or other material was used. For setback, it would be bone on bone contact post op and would not necessitate any grafting so far as I'm aware. Probably removal of some previous graft material, in fact.
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The problem is that I, MYSELF don't like it.
My chin protrudes past the tip of my nose now.
That actually might be very attractive and you don't realize it. PM me confidential pics for a full facial analysis and advice on what you could have done/change.
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The problem is that I, MYSELF don't like it.
My chin protrudes past the tip of my nose now.
The problem is your nose, not your jaws.
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those are significant advancements but not enormous. probably bit above average. not sure why people are saying otherwise.
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My movements were maxilla 9mm and mandible 14mm, but with CW rotation with 5mm downgrafting. I could see at first the change but after a year I have become accustomed to my new face and cant even envision my old alignment. My family still comments on the change though. In a good way. Just give yourself time. I do have some minor numbness in my right lower lip and would be concerned with more serious damage to do any kind of revision.
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it's actually good to have your jaws further out than your nose. look at jason statham. stop being such a p*ssy.
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The first rule of jaw surgery:
If you like your face and don't have functional problems, don't have jaw surgery.
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The first rule of jaw surgery:
If you like your face and don't have functional problems, don't have jaw surgery.
I had sleep apnea.
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it's actually good to have your jaws further out than your nose. look at jason statham. stop being such a p*ssy.
1. Jason Statham's jaws are not further out than his nose. My jaws protrude more than his.
2. How am I being a p*ssy?
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1. Jason Statham's jaws are not further out than his nose. My jaws protrude more than his.
2. How am I being a p*ssy?
1. Okay, fine.
2. You had a successful surgery with a result most people would die for without it sounds much if any complications. Congrats. Your family and friends say you look better. Hence, what the f**k are you whining about? It's always a bit strange after any surgery and you second guess the change. But you'll get used to it. You can't undo it, well maybe you can but at your peril.
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1. Okay, fine.
2. You had a successful surgery with a result most people would die for without it sounds much if any complications. Congrats. Your family and friends say you look better. Hence, what the f**k are you whining about? It's always a bit strange after any surgery and you second guess the change. But you'll get used to it. You can't undo it, well maybe you can but at your peril.
Lazlo, do you think this guy is trolling? He keeps going on about how women find him attractive, and how he has 'Brad Pitt's jaw' etc. He's going on and on about the amazing improvement he's had and yet refuses to show us any photographic proof of this. Why is that? It makes no sense when he's already stated that he doesn't mind if his surgeon puts photos up. This is all one big troll. If you're real protruder then show us some proof, and stop this bulls**t complaining about getting the kind of result others only dream of.
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Lazlo, do you think this guy is trolling? He keeps going on about how women find him attractive, and how he has 'Brad Pitt's jaw' etc. He's going on and on about the amazing improvement he's had and yet refuses to show us any photographic proof of this. Why is that? It makes no sense when he's already stated that he doesn't mind if his surgeon puts photos up. This is all one big troll. If you're real protruder then show us some proof, and stop this bulls**t complaining about getting the kind of result others only dream of.
Who the fook is this guy?
When did I say that my jaw looks like Brad Pitt's? That's what my surgeon says and its obviously bulls**t.
I've also never said that I had an amazing improvement. I only had an improvement in my sleep apnea. In my opinion, my looks have not improved, nor do my friends or family think that. And I look very different than before, that bothers me. What I did say is that women that I didn't know before surgery do find me attractive now and that surprises me, because I feel like I look like a f**king horse.
Do you dream about having your jaws protruding further than your nose? Only prognathic people have that. It is not the ideal positioning of the jaw.
I don't want to post my picture online. You can post yours.
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You can't judge aesthetics by this black and white 'His/her jaws are further forward than nose that means they are attractive'..
Some people have recessed mandibles and are more attractive than those with an ante face - there are NO hard rules for facial aesthetics. Case in point - I had a rhinoplasty and though my nose is straighter, it messed up my facial harmony...
If women are attracted to you, you won... game over.
Well that was not my intention with jaw surgery, I had no problems in that aspect before surgery either.
I just wanted to fix my apnea, and thought I would stay looking pretty much the same, but I look completely different and feel I lost the me. People don't recognize me.
But yeah women find me attractive, that's what most of you guys only care about. If you though that having surgery to put your nose on your forehead would make you more attractive you'd do it in a heartbeat, right?
Nobody seems to understand what im going through after this surgery... I don't look bad, but its not my face.
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I think you can definitely bring both jaws backwards a bit if you're that unsatisfied about the result -- that shouldn't involve much ortho prep work. It is another major surgery though with possible complications, more so because it would be a revision. But plenty of people have had revision jaw surgery. It might also be possible to reposition just your chin back with a sliding genioplasty. Just something like 3mm could make a big difference and probably wouldn't negatively affect the appearance of your mentolabial fold. You should get an experienced surgeon's take on this.
What surprises me is you said you got compared to Robert Pattinson before the surgery. Well he has a very pronounced jawline and forwardly grown face, right? I'm getting a little bit more advancement than you had done but my jaws are very recessed, and it sounds like yours weren't. It's unfortunate you had sleep apnea that necessitated such drastic surgery even though your jaws looked normal, to your eyes at least. Did you have any of the other risk factors (high BMI, large neck circumference)?
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Im not sure about revision. I visited another surgeon and he agreed that I was over advanced but he wouldn't bother with surgery again because of possible complications, and said that it would only be bringing back the jaws a couple mm so he thinks its not worth it.
Several people used to tell me I looked like Robert Pattinson, but my lower jaw was definitely recessed and I had a class 2 malocclusion. My jaws definitely didn't look like his. I guess it was more about the eyes, hair, nose, skin color...
My BMI is low, im skinny and have a normal neck. Just my jaw was recessed and my airway was too small.
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I see. This definitely sounds like a case of the mind's eye not keeping up with the physical change. You probably have a very wrong idea in your head of what you used to look like and what you look like now. All we see is a distorted image of ourselves in the mirror while other people view us in 3D, from many angles, and in motion. So you're ironically not the best judge of how you look. If you posted pictures we could provide some input. But from what you've said, it sounds like you have nothing to worry about.
Also, you probably have forward head posture, which develops as a mechanism to compensate for a small airway. From my understanding jaw surgery doesn't automatically fix head posture so you'd have to work on that. I'm almost certain your chin doesn't protrude past your nose and that it only looks that way because your posture is bad.
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I see. This definitely sounds like a case of the mind's eye not keeping up with the physical change. You probably have a very wrong idea in your head of what you used to look like and what you look like now. All we see is a distorted image of ourselves in the mirror while other people view us in 3D, from many angles, and in motion. So you're ironically not the best judge of how you look. If you posted pictures we could provide some input. But from what you've said, it sounds like you have nothing to worry about.
Also, you probably have forward head posture, which develops as a mechanism to compensate for a small airway. From my understanding jaw surgery doesn't automatically fix head posture so you'd have to work on that. I'm almost certain your chin doesn't protrude past your nose and that it only looks that way because your posture is bad.
I do have forward head posture from being a mouth breather my whole childhood. How can I fix that?
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I think your problem is the ANS being removed - collapsed nose and bad upper lip angle being the result. There are textbook cases that look just like that.
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I think your problem is the ANS being removed - collapsed nose and bad upper lip angle being the result. There are textbook cases that look just like that.
Can you show an example?
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Can you show an example?
http://imgur.com/a/3I5fD
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http://imgur.com/a/3I5fD
Why does that happen? I mean, why would they remove my ANS? Is it fixable?
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Your surgeon should have warned you about this. One guy I consulted with told me this several times. You have psychological trouble adjusting to the 'new' image of yourself. You've had a self-image that you've been used to looking at for over X number of years (however old you are) and now it's dramatically changed.. that can be a shock.
You should have thought about this before you went through with it honestly and weighed up the psychological ramifications of changing something so personal... I know you had sleep apnea.. but it should have entered into your thinking.
The surgeon I saw said this can be particularly difficult for older people who get surgery for sleep apnea as the movements (like yours) are much stronger than most cases.
Go to a psychologist or have the maxfac refer you to one for advice, I'm sure he will have seen many patients who get the same issue.
Im already seeing one, thanks anyways.
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Why does that happen? I mean, why would they remove my ANS? Is it fixable?
Typically it's done to prevent the nose tip from rising too much from the advancement and the upper lip from becoming too convex.
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i can help you fix your posture, and the result will be that your jaw will protrude less. in fact, i fixed my posture, and breathing has now become more difficult, and my jaw has become less pronounced, increasing my need and desire for surgery.
just to warn you - there is nothing easy or quick about fixing your posture when you are an adult, it takes much more dedication and decipline than putting on a few pounds or loosing them - but the results are life changing way beyond the aestetics.
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[ ignore this post if you are not interested in improving posture, protruder am posting it here and not in pm as others might benefit]
to fix your posture you need two things, 1 mindset and 2 tools
1) mindset
basically you have to be become obsessed in a good way. as with our mutual quest of optimizing our facial bone structure:
- you need to take total ownership, because nobody else really cares (as with your face)
- you need to become an expert on anatomy and kinetics, as your problems and solutions are interdependent, you need to accept that the answers are confusing, and can run contrary to popular belief
-you need to realise that there is not one exercise or one video that will fix it, every second of every day in which you are not getting better you are getting worse, you need to enjoy the road (and this is a huge difference from fixing your jaw, where the right doctor can make a huge impact and you can be done with it)
2) tools
a) macro and b) micro bodywork
macro (feldenkrais, ideokinesis, pilates, yoga (except feldenkrais useless if not done one on one for at leasat 20 sessions)
check this guy out
https://www.youtube.com/user/2stunden
go out and start doing feldenkrais if you cant find the motivation to do it by yourself, to get an awareness of your body.
the cool thing, is that once you start getting into it, you feel better straight away. you will notice straight away that this stuff works. and feldenkrais is basically free, as you can download lessens and then do them. you should do some classes, but once you understood the concept, you can progress on your own, as this was designed to be done by listening, not by instruction.
also look for ideokinesis
go out and try to find some other, general movement teachers, the best ones are hard to find, and reluctant to work with you, until they see your passion for willing to improve. they are working with actors, or with the professional sports teams. they are attached to theatre study programs, etc.
these guys are good because they look at the body as a whole more so than physios.
physios
physios can also help, but 90% are useless and dont know jack s**t (same goes for personal trainer) or they do have knowledge, but they are too lazy to invest their time into you. they know good exersises, but these only work if you do them right, again and again and again, like learning how to pitch a slider. they have to retrain your body which you have missused your entire life (as most of us have). they need to teach you about your scapular control, your diaf. breathing, your multifudus activation.
i have spent easily 50k on physios and trainers over the last 20 years, and i only found out about feldenkrais in ideokinesis in the last two, which has helped me the most