Author Topic: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?  (Read 78497 times)

Questioning_Options

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #75 on: July 06, 2015, 05:29:34 PM »
I recognize the general attitudes and choice of language that the OP uses as part of the Sluthate subculture (along with the associated forums, PUAHate, lookism.net, etc.). I've come across those websites numerous times looking for info and before/after pics on jaw surgery and think that they are one of the main sources of users on this forum.

If I had to give the OP advice, I'd try to keep it pithy with two points that he should keep in mind when considering these matters.

First, Sluthate is emotionally and morally toxic. People arrive there as socially awkward young men wondering why they aren't successful with women. Sluthate informs them that the problem is that women are only interested in men with absurdly high physical (and sometimes monetary) standards. (For people unfamiliar with the site, it's not uncommon there for people to say things like "all men under 6'4 are unattractive to women," or "if you are not famous, any attractive girl will inevitably cheat on you.") Why are men so compelled by this kind of thing? Obviously it makes them feel hopeless, but the hopelessness has some appeal to people with mild narcissistic traits, as it tells them that the pity they seek in others is well-deserved. Nothing is more offensive to a narcissistic person than the notion that their lives are miserable because they're lazy basement-dwellers. (I don't mean to offend; I don't think you're a full-blown narcissist. But I suspect, like many people, you have some mildly narcissistic traits that are nurtured by online communities like Sluthate. It is typical for them to be explosively angry at any suggestion that they genuinely try to improve themselves or take initative: "IT'S A SCAM!")

Secondly, as other people have observed, you look a little better than average, and I suspect that most women would agree. You have height on your side, too. It's true that you're no male model, and that you're more of a 6 out of 10 than a 9.5, but such is life. It is not a medical problem to not be astoundingly handsome. It is not a tragedy that you weren't automatically dealt a better hand in life than 99.99% of other men. If you have the tastes for only the finest things in life, you'd better be willing to work hard or accept a lot of disappointment in life. It is uncommon for women who are not desperate to approach men to date, period. You'd know this if you spent your time experiencing social situations rather than theorizing about them based on online photos.

Don't take this as hostile, but rather some friendly advice. I'm not going to try to stop you from embracing any procedures, but I'd say that you should get your emotional issues fixed first, lest you end up like a plastic surgery freak in a few years, or deeply regretful of destroying your natural features.

Questioning_Options

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #76 on: July 06, 2015, 05:31:35 PM »
I'll also add that OP's proportions look completely normal by any reasonable (read: non-Sluthate) standards.

Charles-Guillaume

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #77 on: July 06, 2015, 05:51:46 PM »
I recognize the general attitudes and choice of language that the OP uses as part of the Sluthate subculture (along with the associated forums, PUAHate, lookism.net, etc.). I've come across those websites numerous times looking for info and before/after pics on jaw surgery and think that they are one of the main sources of users on this forum.

If I had to give the OP advice, I'd try to keep it pithy with two points that he should keep in mind when considering these matters.

First, Sluthate is emotionally and morally toxic. People arrive there as socially awkward young men wondering why they aren't successful with women. Sluthate informs them that the problem is that women are only interested in men with absurdly high physical (and sometimes monetary) standards. (For people unfamiliar with the site, it's not uncommon there for people to say things like "all men under 6'4 are unattractive to women," or "if you are not famous, any attractive girl will inevitably cheat on you.") Why are men so compelled by this kind of thing? Obviously it makes them feel hopeless, but the hopelessness has some appeal to people with mild narcissistic traits, as it tells them that the pity they seek in others is well-deserved. Nothing is more offensive to a narcissistic person than the notion that their lives are miserable because they're lazy basement-dwellers. (I don't mean to offend; I don't think you're a full-blown narcissist. But I suspect, like many people, you have some mildly narcissistic traits that are nurtured by online communities like Sluthate. It is typical for them to be explosively angry at any suggestion that they genuinely try to improve themselves or take initative: "IT'S A SCAM!")

Secondly, as other people have observed, you look a little better than average, and I suspect that most women would agree. You have height on your side, too. It's true that you're no male model, and that you're more of a 6 out of 10 than a 9.5, but such is life. It is not a medical problem to not be astoundingly handsome. It is not a tragedy that you weren't automatically dealt a better hand in life than 99.99% of other men. If you have the tastes for only the finest things in life, you'd better be willing to work hard or accept a lot of disappointment in life. It is uncommon for women who are not desperate to approach men to date, period. You'd know this if you spent your time experiencing social situations rather than theorizing about them based on online photos.

Don't take this as hostile, but rather some friendly advice. I'm not going to try to stop you from embracing any procedures, but I'd say that you should get your emotional issues fixed first, lest you end up like a plastic surgery freak in a few years, or deeply regretful of destroying your natural features.

I don't disagree with you, for most the part. There is something akin to an "epidemy of narcissism" out there, nurtured primarily by Western attitudes to life in general.

Now, what doesn't sit well with me is your unfounded abstraction of my attitude. I have partaken in a multitude of social situations, and experienced the cold hand of rejection every time. Whatever "out of ten" my looks are, nothing seems to indicate that they are sufficient. If I am, as you would estimate, a "6/10", what prevents me from ascending the ladder by a point or two by means of osteotomical procedures? Surely "looks" are nothing more than the sum of their parts, and by improving the individual features and their spacing, becoming better-looking should be a real possibility.

The fact that a neurotypical and suave guy can get away with being ugly or average (never have I denied the possibility and reality of this) doesn't mean that I can. For the record, I don't believe the people who claim that I am behaviourially "normal", and I also don't believe those who would maintain that swapping my unattractive personality for one that is more advantageous is easier than surgically improving my looks.

I don't think that I "deserve" being a "9.5/10" or better-looking than basically every other male. In fact, I don't think that I "deserve" anything at all. I just wanted to know what exactly could be done to improve the hand that I was dealt. If it is very obvious that I am a "six" or thereabouts, it should be equally obvious what alteration could make me a "seven" or whatever. Can we please try to focus on this, instead of my mental state?

Isn't being prepared to risk one's life to achieve looks more congruent with the ideal self an effort of sorts? It certainly doesn't entail "doing nothing", as every fiber of my being is engaged in this ordeal every waking hour of my life. I am not afraid in the slightest to give dangerous procedures a shot if they can grant me a real, tangible chance of becoming better-looking so that I may experience a vaguely normal emotional life without having to pretend to be something that I clearly am not.

I am pretty much incapable of being offended (there isn't much that I have yet to hear), so there is no need to go easy on me.

Lazlo

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #78 on: July 06, 2015, 07:50:52 PM »
this is pretty depressing.

Charles-Guillaume

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #79 on: July 06, 2015, 08:14:51 PM »
this is pretty depressing.
Just for the record I am considering your offer. Proper consideration takes time! :)

Anyhow, I wouldn't want to see this state of affairs as depressing. Rather, I think that it is beyond amazing that there is actually a possibility for me to attain a set of looks that I am comfortable with. Regardless of what people would "rate" me, I could finally be free and happy with the knowledge that I like the way that I look.

Countless people have died with far less than I have had in my relatively short lifespan, despite the fact that I have had so little personal love and attraction. If I can die pursuing my dream (well, except for answering Leibniz' great quesiton) one might say that I will die happily. I certainly don't desire death if life seems to have more to offer, and with certain adjustments to my face, I could definitely picture living happily.

You see, I am not entirely bereaved of (impersonal) love. I love writing and playing music, singing, dancing, and more thereto. Though I am an introvert I don't doubt that I would get along perfectly well with you and most other friendly people here. I don't lack friends, never have, and probably never will. Somehow, though, I struggle to make any of this truly matter when I can't get the face that I see in the mirror and photos to congrue with the picture that I paint of myself in my head.

Comparing myself to my parents and grandparents, I have certain traits that none of them had, and I most certainly wonder why I have them at all--if this amounts to subideal development or an unusual genetic recombination (yes, I am absolutely certain that I am a lineal descendant of those people). For example, I have a hooked nose--none of my grandparents did. I have close-set eyes--grandparents, oh no. Those traits bother me way more than anything else bar existential angst, since I struggle to make sense of the fact that I have them in the first place. However, I am a poor judge of myself, and hence possibly inclined to over- and underrate certain aspects. Hence, I wanted to receive external input.

This post is poorly composed (can't sleep), but I just wanted somehow to make it all seem less "depressing" and more "well, that's that".

Lazlo

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #80 on: July 06, 2015, 10:13:13 PM »
Buddy, you're very young. You can turn all this around in a heartbeat but you have to listen to me. I mean actually f**king listen. First, it's fine if you're pursuing certain surgical options. Your first op went magnificently and has indeed made you much more attractive, more what you indeed should look like. Second, fine maybe the chin-wing etc. too. The eye-spacing thing. Okay we don't know if it's doable. You're already handsome in my books but fine, if it's safe and doable and there are indeed a few docs willing to do it from what I've heard already, but you need to first see some proof on this and also a visualization.

As far as my offer, honestly, you can come visit me (PM me for my city and I have my own apartment, come hang here for a week and we can have a fun time there's room to crash at my place) --I'm just offering this because you seem very intelligent but just I dunno maybe you haven't found the right social circle or group of friends yet --and I'm always up to party. At least I could help you with the how to socialize with girls angle. I have braces and I still get laid when I want, though I don't want to that often anymore cause I'm a bit depressed but whatever that's another story.....


Lazlo

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #81 on: July 06, 2015, 10:18:01 PM »
wait i totally got lost on a tangent. once you have the final surgery, whatever it is, you have to like leave the internet and these boards forever. Questioning Options is correct, too much of this is morally toxic indeed and will only hurt you in the real world. But it will be really really f**king difficult, in fact you may have to go somewhere where they don't have computers for a while like an ahram or a f**king monastery or something or a commune. Hell, if you have the cash I'll go with you on a roadtrip to a commune or something for a while (there are bound to be seriously hot chicks at a commune dude....WHAT AN ADVENTURE!!!! Ajhhh and you all handsome from your orbital box osteotomy and in the bloom of youth WE WILL KILL IT!!!)

Come over here, I'll introduce you to my friends as the Prince of Denmark or whatever --but seriously, you will absolutely HAVE to work on your social skills no matter how handsome you become, and part of that will involve massively shifting your paradigm if you know what I mean. And if you'r on puahate or whatever. STOP.

Lazlo

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #82 on: July 06, 2015, 10:52:48 PM »
apparently sinn is willing to do the eye spacing thing --but it takes him and he'd want a neurosurgeon plus another specialist in the room and it would be MASSIVELY expensive. But I think he'd do it. But i mean if you're that rich bro...the world is your oyster. Just fly down to to Texas (fly me down to it's a fun place to hang out and it'll be less depressing for you!) hehhahh. But yeah, not a problem. Get a pre-vis done first.

babyface99

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #83 on: July 07, 2015, 02:45:35 AM »
This forum won't be the same without you: no more egotistical (coke fueled) rants and random shenanigans... but, you'll be back...

...you all will come back...

we are all so f**ked up in the head its not even funny.

babyface99

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #84 on: July 07, 2015, 02:49:00 AM »
like in every thread its one person asking about some extreme surgery and than everyone will chime in on how they need to accept and what not. A week rolls by and the people who preached acceptance will be asking about a different surgery THEY want, and the first OP will be the one preaching. We are all completely f**king neurotic.

Charles-Guillaume

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #85 on: July 07, 2015, 03:09:46 AM »
Thanks for the excellent information and well-intentioned (but not very efficacious in my case, unfortunately) motivational speeches, Lazlo. You're some dude. :)

we are all so f**ked up in the head its not even funny.

I have been like this for as long as I can remember. Even before the bullying properly started (though I was silently ostracised, I suppose that's just a more subtle form of bullying), at age 9 or so, I would spend several minutes--foreshadowing hours--at a time watching myself in the mirror, keeping tabs on my weight (I was a bit tubby as a young kid) and covering the sides of my face with my hands to make it more "handsome" (back then I identified the problem as fat cheeks, but in hindsight it might have been a reaction to the close-set eyes).

I remember one particular time when I had lost some weight, and happily marched into my parents' room at night proclaiming my great conquest. Another time I wore a bandana, and it framed my prepubescent face quite nicely and made my then literally white (sometimes, being Nordic sucks) hair look pretty badass. These events brought me great surges of dopamine as I would continually ominously envision myself as growing up to become a fat, bald man.

Hence, it seems to be that my "transhandsomeism" (is that a thing? can I get the government to support my project? ;)) had already made itself known at a very tender age. The difference being that back then, it didn't permeate my every thought, and I could still do things unrelated to my obsession.

Once I became a little bit older and sexually mature, however, things predictably took a turn for the worse. There was nothing there for me, only mockery (primarily by girls, related to my ugliness) and beatings (primarily by guys, related to my academic achievement and probably also ugliness, or perhaps more aptly put, lack of masculine sexual dimorphism). Ever since, becoming good-looking has been my sole telluric goal. First I wanted to become a palaeontologist. Then I wanted to become... physically attractive.

I'm typing this after a long night of not sleeping at all, so please pardon inconsistencies and ramblings. Just thought that I should share my "backstory" with you lot, in case anyone is interested and/or can relate to my experiences. At the very least, perhaps this could explain to some why I am so adamant about really having this stuff done, although it is grossly atypical, kind of risky, and ludicrously expensive.

I do realise that most people would look at me as though I were from another planet if I told them that I would rather spend, say, $100.000 (don't quote me on that figure, I just made it up) on complex craniofacial surgery to move my eyes a few mm further apart than on a cool, expensive car, a great apartment, or whatever it is that appeals to people in general.

Hell, to be honest, I would rather have my ideal looks--which, again, do not primarily amount to some abstract x/10 but rather a set of proportions that I probabilistically should have inherited in the first place--and a chance to relive my lost youth than all the money in the world.

« Last Edit: July 07, 2015, 03:43:31 AM by Charles-Guillaume »

PloskoPlus

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #86 on: July 07, 2015, 04:20:20 AM »
This forum won't be the same without you: no more egotistical (coke fueled) rants
I thought they were fuelled by Ashtanga Yoga.

Optimistic

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #87 on: July 07, 2015, 04:38:29 AM »
Buddy, you're very young. You can turn all this around in a heartbeat but you have to listen to me. I mean actually f**king listen. First, it's fine if you're pursuing certain surgical options. Your first op went magnificently and has indeed made you much more attractive, more what you indeed should look like. Second, fine maybe the chin-wing etc. too. The eye-spacing thing. Okay we don't know if it's doable. You're already handsome in my books but fine, if it's safe and doable and there are indeed a few docs willing to do it from what I've heard already, but you need to first see some proof on this and also a visualization.

As far as my offer, honestly, you can come visit me (PM me for my city and I have my own apartment, come hang here for a week and we can have a fun time there's room to crash at my place) --I'm just offering this because you seem very intelligent but just I dunno maybe you haven't found the right social circle or group of friends yet --and I'm always up to party. At least I could help you with the how to socialize with girls angle. I have braces and I still get laid when I want, though I don't want to that often anymore cause I'm a bit depressed but whatever that's another story.....

Can I come party and do coke with you too?
01/10/14 - Last night I spilt spaghetti sauce on my chin for the very first time in my life and cried.

Lazlo

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #88 on: July 07, 2015, 10:31:55 AM »

Yeah Charles-Guillaume, listen many of us have experiences of extreme bullying. So did I and just as bad, but I got over it and tooth and nail climbed out of the trauma and became a boss.
Like you however I am highly neurotic --all this obsessive compulsive thinking etc. you recount --this is neurosis and OCD nothing more. Your chemicals are shaping your thoughts and the more you give into these thoughts they're influencing your chemicals. You're not fighting it you're giving in and you haven't even experienced the worst of it. If you keep going down this path you're going to become a dysfunctional vegetable and you'll have to be hospitalized either cause you can't function or you'll try and off yourself. So you need to check yourself before you wreck yourself motherf**ker.

Now if you actually have a plan of attack (on life, not just your f**king looks) but if you have a plan of attack on what you think your goodlooking self should look like get a f**king set of photos and a visualization done and see what you want.

And what's with these photos. Your pose and facial expression makes you look like a retarded vampire. What's up with that? Just take a normal selfie dude with a normal f**king cell phone. A frontal and a profile shot.






Lazlo

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Re: What procedures would you suggest for my eye area?
« Reply #89 on: July 07, 2015, 10:32:33 AM »
Can I come party and do coke with you too?

yes.