Author Topic: cheekbone/malar osteotomy  (Read 34915 times)

Optimistic

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #30 on: August 15, 2013, 01:12:31 PM »
Thanks for the neg, I appreciate it. I don't see how having an accute nasolabial angle and curled upper-lip is a "good" outcome. He looks half-retarded.

By the way, HA paste does "do s**t" and it's actually quite effective. Open your eyes and look around. Read one of the MANY studies that cover this. Or you can continue to spurt absorption myths and say it's ineffective. Whatever. And even IF HA paste was trash then just change HA paste to fillers. Done.
01/10/14 - Last night I spilt spaghetti sauce on my chin for the very first time in my life and cried.

x

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #31 on: August 15, 2013, 01:26:15 PM »
Thanks for the neg, I appreciate it. I don't see how having an accute nasolabial angle and curled upper-lip is a "good" outcome. He looks half-retarded.

By the way, HA paste does "do s**t" and it's actually quite effective. Open your eyes and look around. Read one of the MANY studies that cover this. Or you can continue to spurt absorption myths and say it's ineffective. Whatever. And even IF HA paste was trash then just change HA paste to fillers. Done.
A full upper lip is considered ideal these days, an upper lip that shows little vermilion is bad




I've never seen HA used effectively for anything other than defects left after jaw movements. ask CK if he feels there was any noticeable change to his cheeks with HA, he can tell you from firsthand experience



I didn't neg you but I +1'd you so you'd stop crying

Optimistic

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #32 on: August 15, 2013, 02:06:07 PM »
Having full lips is indeed ideal for both sexes, so you're right in that sense. However there's a big difference between what that person has and what I'm talking about.

Here is an example of the ideal position of the lips (this is pretty gender neutral, it does vary a bit between men and women but you get the idea):



What his does is curve up and close the nasolabial angle to become accute. In men it should be 90-92?. Now I'm not saying this should be like that on ALL men. The model you linked looks to have an angle that is more acute than 90? - but it suits him. Ultimately it's going to depend on the individual. In this case it made the patient look retarded.

Moreover, using models to illustrate an example reeks of puahate. Models do not exemplify aesthetic ideals, rather they possess extreme features and represent passing fads and trends within the industry itself. Plenty of hugely successful models look like average people if you were to see them in the street (see Simon Nessman or Francisco Lachowski). Others simply represent a unique look that people can associate with a brand (David Gandy's piercing blue eyes and black hair).

If the patient wanted or needed fuller lips then perhaps this would've better been achieved through the use of fillers as opposed to messing up the nL angle. That's my 2 cents anyway.

P.S. I apologise for saying you negged me if you didn't.
01/10/14 - Last night I spilt spaghetti sauce on my chin for the very first time in my life and cried.

pumukka

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #33 on: August 31, 2013, 04:52:01 PM »
Maybe I'm in the minority here but I'd love to have that " C "  I'll have some maxillary advancement and  at the moment my angle is kinda like the guy at the top before but I'm afraid my after it will be flat like his after, 

A "curved" top lip has always been a desirable feature at least in woman hence there are many woman having lip augmentation and some even having bullhorn lip lifts just to get that "C" "pouty lips"  :(

Some people upper lip also lifts and curves when they smile and  I read recently that it has also got to do with the dental arch shape :)

Lazlo

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #34 on: August 31, 2013, 10:04:36 PM »
Maybe I'm in the minority here but I'd love to have that " C "  I'll have some maxillary advancement and  at the moment my angle is kinda like the guy at the top before but I'm afraid my after it will be flat like his after, 

A "curved" top lip has always been a desirable feature at least in woman hence there are many woman having lip augmentation and some even having bullhorn lip lifts just to get that "C" "pouty lips"  :(

Some people upper lip also lifts and curves when they smile and  I read recently that it has also got to do with the dental arch shape :)


pumukka, could you please, please link to the article or whatever you read about dental arch shape and lip posture because i desperately want to change this are into a C as well and right now since I'm having orthodontics I feel I could still do something about changing the shape of the arch. thanks.

Optimistic

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #35 on: October 02, 2013, 05:46:28 PM »
Good article on ZSO's if it hasn't already been linked.

http://www.mauricemommaerts.eu/files/PDF/633277834186613750.pdf

Doesn't look like it'll give you male-model cheeks (more to do with buccal fat anyway I think), but it does seem to give good lateral projection and subsequently an improved facial width height ratio.

There was a lot of talk that  ZSO would create feminine cheeks, and for a more masculine appear the lateral upper portion of the zygomatic bone would need to be dealt with. Could someone explain what is meant by this exactly?
01/10/14 - Last night I spilt spaghetti sauce on my chin for the very first time in my life and cried.

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #36 on: October 02, 2013, 05:57:23 PM »
Good article on ZSO's if it hasn't already been linked.

http://www.mauricemommaerts.eu/files/PDF/633277834186613750.pdf

Doesn't look like it'll give you male-model cheeks (more to do with buccal fat anyway I think), but it does seem to give good lateral projection and subsequently an improved facial width height ratio.

There was a lot of talk that  ZSO would create feminine cheeks, and for a more masculine appear the lateral upper portion of the zygomatic bone would need to be dealt with. Could someone explain what is meant by this exactly?
Man if they're going to tout it as a lateral advancement procedure I wish they'd show frontal pics. 3/4ths is too hard as a head tilted slightly different in each pic can throw things off

feminine cheeks: http://i.imgur.com/uHWISKm.jpg?1

masculine: http://iconolo.gy/sites/default/files/TomFord-9.JPG

feminine are more rounded and youthful, masculine is more hollow, a mild AIDS cheeks. masculine has lateral projection of the zygomatic arch but not much forward projection of the zygomatic bone

Optimistic

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #37 on: October 02, 2013, 06:15:51 PM »
Man if they're going to tout it as a lateral advancement procedure I wish they'd show frontal pics. 3/4ths is too hard as a head tilted slightly different in each pic can throw things off

feminine cheeks: http://i.imgur.com/uHWISKm.jpg?1

masculine: http://iconolo.gy/sites/default/files/TomFord-9.JPG

feminine are more rounded and youthful, masculine is more hollow, a mild AIDS cheeks. masculine has lateral projection of the zygomatic arch but not much forward projection of the zygomatic bone

I hear you. Wouldn't that make Mommaert's ZSO a viable way to achieve a bit more lateral projection of the zygomatic arch? If you look at the diagrammes one would think it should help somewhat.

Buccal fat is definitely a huge factor to make the cheeks pop
01/10/14 - Last night I spilt spaghetti sauce on my chin for the very first time in my life and cried.

Lazlo

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #38 on: October 02, 2013, 07:39:38 PM »
I hear you. Wouldn't that make Mommaert's ZSO a viable way to achieve a bit more lateral projection of the zygomatic arch? If you look at the diagrammes one would think it should help somewhat.

Buccal fat is definitely a huge factor to make the cheeks pop

great find with the article, but the pics suck. them having had lefort 1s and all you can't really tell how much was augmented or how it looks.

Optimistic

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #39 on: October 02, 2013, 08:28:54 PM »
great find with the article, but the pics suck. them having had lefort 1s and all you can't really tell how much was augmented or how it looks.

That's true, there was one that gave a good indication of the added projection, and it's this one here...




If you look at the outline on the left-side of his face you can see there's been an ok amount added. Nothing huge, and you're right if he had a Lefort this would be skewed even more. I'll try and get more pictures.
01/10/14 - Last night I spilt spaghetti sauce on my chin for the very first time in my life and cried.

Lazlo

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #40 on: October 02, 2013, 08:50:13 PM »
That's true, there was one that gave a good indication of the added projection, and it's this one here...




If you look at the outline on the left-side of his face you can see there's been an ok amount added. Nothing huge, and you're right if he had a Lefort this would be skewed even more. I'll try and get more pictures.

good work, this is a very important topic and thread. basically the model above which i criticized euphoria(wrongly) for posting is a good indication of what we're looking for that the taper of the cheek proceed OUT from under the eye and then taper at a diagonal down till the beginning of the lower maxilla where it comes out again, then down to the chin and a more dramatic out for a strong chin and jawline. i don't care about crosscultural aesthetics. this is the idea. and if elon musk can build a rocket to marks, we can find a way to shape our beta faces into strong nordic gods!

Optimistic

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #41 on: October 02, 2013, 09:41:23 PM »
I actually already have decent lateral projection it seems (it juts out from my face a good amount in the 3/4 view), just I'd probably benefit from having it higher and a bit more projected. Since the results aren't anything mindblowing I'm not that concerned with being the guinea pig for this forum. I asked Mommaerts and he said that it can be reverse quite simply so all the more reason to try.

Does anyone think a ZSO would have positive anti-ageing benefits? Would it somehow support the face more?
01/10/14 - Last night I spilt spaghetti sauce on my chin for the very first time in my life and cried.

Lord-of-the-Cartilage

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #42 on: October 02, 2013, 11:31:31 PM »
Of course it would provide slightly more support for the skin, meaning you should age better.

What are people's thoughts on this Mommaerts patient?





He has more definition but lost the S curve.
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Optimistic

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #43 on: October 03, 2013, 12:25:50 AM »
He never had the S curve / doesn't look to have changed at all.
01/10/14 - Last night I spilt spaghetti sauce on my chin for the very first time in my life and cried.

Lord-of-the-Cartilage

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Re: cheekbone/malar osteotomy
« Reply #44 on: October 03, 2013, 12:28:34 AM »
It has changed, looked more angular in the before 3/4 view.

Actually I've just realised it could be to a different head position, maybe you're right.
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