IMDO????

[Lazlo]

Don't quote me on this but i"m almost certain he only does this s**t on growing patientes who are under 14 --He won't do it on adults --he'll just do a basic bsso and waste your time. I'm not sure. Maybe he's advanced give it a shot.

[Lord-of-the-Cartilage]

Looks like he always had gonial definition but they tried to photoshop it away in the before.

[Bobbit]

Why can't surgeons just post up on their web sites the standard   frontal and profile view photos - - - taken with their standard office background for documenting patients,  and taken without hair styling and taken from the same perspective ?

It would be a lot more convincing and a lot less deceiving.

 

   

[JimmyTheGent]

No... really,  there is no qualification needed.  For example,  the slope of his forehead above the eyebrows is different, and not as "slopped" backwards.   That was the starting point for me.

His Forehead is sloped before and after.

[Bobbit]

His Forehead is sloped before and after.

Yes.  Agreed.  But look closer.   The orbital rims are different and the posterior slope of the forehead is less pronounced in the "after" picture.

I am pretty sure that those aesthetically pleasing image changes are a result of either (non-disclosed) complex craniofacial forehead surgery,  or photoshopping.

[Jol]

Yes.  Agreed.  But look closer.   The orbital rims are different and the posterior slope of the forehead is less pronounced in the "after" picture.

I am pretty sure that those aesthetically pleasing image changes are a result of either (non-disclosed) complex craniofacial forehead surgery,  or photoshopping.

But you don't know how much time there is between photos? The distance to the camera, angles etc is also probably different.

An accusation of deliberate 'photoshopping' shouldn't be taken lightly.

Would you say this is also photoshopped?
https://www.facebook.com/profilosurgical/photos/a.358119377569695.76662.358073987574234/925462037502090/?type=3&theater

[Bobbit]

But you don't know how much time there is between photos? The distance to the camera, angles etc is also probably different.

An accusation of deliberate 'photoshopping' shouldn't be taken lightly.

Would you say this is also photoshopped?
https://www.facebook.com/profilosurgical/photos/a.358119377569695.76662.358073987574234/925462037502090/?type=3&theater

It is not just a question of photoshopping the digital image.   The problem extends to such things as  make-up / no make-up ,    and / or  hair styling.

In this case,  the object of the comparison is to sell the surgeons jaw surgery skills and results.   But it looks like there has also been some undisclosed rhino work, as well as lipstick added, change in hairstyles .... multiple details.

[Jol]

But it looks like there has also been some undisclosed rhino work, as well as lipstick added, change in hairstyles .... multiple details.

But really you have no idea and are directly accusing Dr C of

There is only one purpose to that sort of thing - -  an intention to mislead the potential patient.

These are teenagers he is operating on, the second photos can be a year or more later, they grow, they change.

In this case there is no lipstick, no undisclosed rhino work and no other tricks or illusions. Time has passed, the lighting is different, the photo is taken in a different location.

Better picture here perhaps
http://www.profilosurgical.com.au/jaw-surgery/imdo-overbite-surgery

[Bobbit]

But really you have no idea. These are teenagers he is operating on, the second photos can be a year or more later, they grow, they change.

In this case there is no lipstick, no undisclosed rhino work and no other tricks or illusions. Time has passed, the lighting is different, the photo is taken in a different location.

There is a mandate from the plastic surgeons board certification that the surgeons not use deceptive pictures for demonstrating results.

To the intellectually honest surgeons,  that means before and after pictures taken in the same lighting, in the same poses and postures, and without unnecessary make-up/ hair styling, etc. 

Yes,  kids change.  Which makes it all the more important to NOT change the lighting.  Her lips are RED in the after picture.  They are pale flesh/native vermilion toned in the before picture.   

Her change to her teeth and jaw are spectacular success for that young girl.   That should have been "good enough" for the surgeon posting pictures of her.   But there is a good likelihood there was some other work done with the nose,  for example,  that can be misleading.  If he had simply disclosed any of the additional work and held the imaging to a  same-same standard,  then there would be no objection.   He did not need to gild this Lily.

[Jol]

But there is a good likelihood there was some other work done with the nose,  for example,

Bollocks. She hasn't had any nose work.

The photo was taken in a different office, at a different time of year, well over a year later, be close to impossible to get the lighting exactly the same. It's just his receptionist who takes the photos with a standard camera.

What if one photo is taken after winter and one after the summer break? skin colour can be quite different.

Problem is you're accusing Dr C of being misleading and just making assertions when really you don't know.

Frankly I can't see what can possibly be misleading in the third picture down here (or the others for that matter)
http://www.profilosurgical.com.au/jaw-surgery/imdo-overbite-surgery

[ppsk]

have to agree with jol, there really is not indication of extensive photoshop work, which is why i asked you to qualify it to begin with.

I just don't see it. The only one that looks even remotely suspect is the adult man on the previous page who looks to have had some brow growth - this can be explained by other mechanisms however. The male brow does grow well into the early 20s.

[mothman]

so can this imdo be done if your have normal bite but going for aesthetic gain? anyone know if he performs regular bimax with rotations? be good to have someone in australia instead of having to travel to see sinn or zarrinbal all the time.

[ppsk]

so can this imdo be done if your have normal bite but going for aesthetic gain? anyone know if he performs regular bimax with rotations? be good to have someone in australia instead of having to travel to see sinn or zarrinbal all the time.

They definitely do bimax. I feel it should be pointed out that bimax is literally the bread and butter of maxfacs, every single one of them does it. I would take any notions about only so and so doctor being able to perform a particular movement with a fistful of salt, most of that stuff reeks of self-marketing. Obviously when looking for a surgeon you want someone with a lot of experience but in so far as technical considerations, its pretty objective and uniform I feel.

I've got the consult on wednesday, so I'll be sure to ask about IMDO specifically vs bimax for aesthetic outcome.

re: zarrinbal sinn et al, I would not travel to these guys specifically for a bimax because again its a limited operation, its not like plastic surgery where you have to take artistic considerations into account, all maxfacs use objective measurements and analysis for their work, and the capabilities of the operation are very black and white per my understanding. You travel to guys like Zarrinbal or sinn for operations that aren't widely performed, like bony contouring surgeries (ZSO, chin wing etc). If its just bimax i would start very local. The only reason I'm not starting local is because I believe I'm a candidate for surgery first approach, and that hasn't caught on here in australia yet as far as I can tell (its big time popular in south korea though, which is very close!)

[JimmyTheGent]

I read the website and I do not see anything about the maxilla.  Does that mean IMDO is only done in lieu of a BSSO and you still have to have the Lefort or can they do IMDO on the maxilla as well?

[Bobbit]

 . . .  all maxfacs use objective measurements and analysis for their work, and the capabilities of the operation are very black and white per my understanding.

You might think about that some more.    There are world class Ortho's  who have repeatedly changed the surgeons doing the jaw surgeries for their patients - - because of unsatisfactory surgery results - -  until they found one they could consistently recommend to their patients with expectations of a good outcome.